MLM Lead System Pro vs. Online MLM Mastermind System??

Hardy Usman

16 years ago

Both offers $1 trial. Why don't you give it a shot?

Thanks

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Loren Woirhaye

16 years ago

My instinct is they are both B.S. that will hurt you in
building a sustainable business. Programs of this nature
will try to get you to promote the affiliate program
itself - and the notion is that you make a "back end"
offer of your real business. Not a good idea. I've tested
things like this.

If you want to sell vitamins and enroll vitamin distributors -
do that. Be transparent and tell people about your
business. Don't waste your time marketing "lead generation
systems" to people in other companies as an affiliate.

I've been doing this for awhile. I've seen these things come
and go. They won't help you build your mlm much at all -
it's just a trap to sell you on video marketing gimmicks
and social networking nonsense. That's my opinion from
what I've seen. It's unfair, yeah - but I can virtually
guarantee you if you get caught-up in one of these things
your energy will be redirected from your "primary" company
into promoting the "all the same" lead capture pages
they'll give you.

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7figurehelper

16 years ago

Originally Posted by Loren Woirhaye

My instinct is they are both B.S. that will hurt you in
building a sustainable business. Programs of this nature
will try to get you to promote the affiliate program
itself - and the notion is that you make a "back end"
offer of your real business. Not a good idea. I've tested
things like this.

If you want to sell vitamins and enroll vitamin distributors -
do that. Be transparent and tell people about your
business. Don't waste your time marketing "lead generation
systems" to people in other companies as an affiliate.

I've been doing this for awhile. I've seen these things come
and go. They won't help you build your mlm much at all -
it's just a trap to sell you on video marketing gimmicks
and social networking nonsense. That's my opinion from
what I've seen. It's unfair, yeah - but I can virtually
guarantee you if you get caught-up in one of these things
your energy will be redirected from your "primary" company
into promoting the "all the same" lead capture pages
they'll give you.

This is the first time I will have to disagree with you to an extent. Yes most people get attraction marketing wrong, heck even I did when first starting out.

But then I realized you always have to examine what people are saying and change it up. You must sound different. I've had more success using MLSP than I did building my former companies the traditional way.

I don't know about others but I love having a system that weeds out the time wasters. I love making money in my sleep off people that don't even join me in my opp. I can sleep good about it b/c I know what I'm offering truly has value that has helped me grow my biz.

I disagree with Charles 100% about starting your own funded proposal. It takes a lot of hard work, money, energy, resources, and time. Why not leverage what someone else has done.

I believe you can have more than 1 target market. Promote the system to network marketers and promote your biz to those looking to get started in that industry.

It works for me well. You just HAVE TO BE YOURSELF AND NOT SOUND LIKE EVERYONE ELSE.

In my opinion and this is it, most that are doing attraction marketing are "throwing up" the same way when you meet someone and they just blast their biz opp on you.

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tush 16 years ago

I totally agree with 7figurehelper. This is what I have learnt the hard way.

If you think you will build a huge network marketing organization using funded proposals, think again. Most people who land on these systems have their companies which they love dearly. The last thing they want is to join another opportunity. They are looking for how to info. I am not saying that It can't be done, well it can......

The story is of course different if you are the Creator of the system. You can build a crawling organisation in a matter of days because most people would love to be on your team. In fact, some people have complained that after referring their clients to these funded proposals (one complaint is from one of the two systems we are discussing here) they end up joining the company of the funded proposal owner:confused: So 7figurehelper, for those who can create these systems, they should go ahead. The hard work, energy and money spent will be received 10fold.

Should one promote them? Absolutely. It has been proved that network marketers love info, especially that which promises them to earn $$$ in a short time, whether you promote them or not, they will buy them from some one else, so you better learn how to get your share. This income is very helpful. It will help you to stay in network marketing industry for a long time. Most network marketers drop out because they can't afford the monthly autoship. With these funded proposals, you will stay in profit. You will get cash to advertise your business. You will be able to stay long enough in the industry to see the fruits.

So, how do you grow your business? Target Network marketers and those looking for business opportunity or those searching for the product your company offers eg vitamins, juice,etc. With this strategy, you can't go wrong
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- tomp 16 years ago
  
  I tend to agree with the "neither" reply.
  
  With either you still have to know how to market (drive traffic to) the squeeze pages and brand yourself. That's where these systems leave you high and dry.
  
  Heck you can do that and need to do this anyway with a really good "training sells" type personal "about you" blog that demonstrates your "lead with value" and "Lead by example" leadership qualities.
  
  Put up affiliate links to the best attraction marketing training (Sieg, Dillard) that captures leads info and make similar education posts and there's your "free training" to prospects about who you are and what your opportunities are. Monetize the blog and perhaps put up a free education newsletter to capture more leads and bam off you go. All bases covered for much less $ and it's yours and 100% UNIQUE.
  
  My opin is to not bother with those systems. Ridiculous.
  
  Thanks
  
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kerry29

16 years ago

I tried them both. Loren has a point, don't get distracted from your primary business. HOWEVER, I am a fan of the Mastermind system (having left MLMLSP). The way I use it it to promote my primary business. I create custom capture pages directly related and promoting my primary business that lead them to my primary sales page.

Currently, I use the "lead generating" system as a secondary measure. The key is to stay focused on your primary business.

I hope this helps!

Thanks
1 reply

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Christian Chan

16 years ago

You can also do that without using the Mastermind system. IMHO, both suck.

Originally Posted by kerry29

I tried them both. Loren has a point, don't get distracted from your primary business. HOWEVER, I am a fan of the Mastermind system (having left MLMLSP). The way I use it it to promote my primary business. I create custom capture pages directly related and promoting my primary business that lead them to my primary sales page.

Currently, I use the "lead generating" system as a secondary measure. The key is to stay focused on your primary business.

I hope this helps!

Thanks

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mentor_nz Banned 16 years ago

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- JackieUlmer 16 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by mentor_nz
  
  This forum is not the best place to ask that question ER70275 as I am not aware of anyone here who has made or is making significant money in MLM.
  
  Hmm, I can see this is a good time for me to jump in, as I am making a great, high, six figure annual income in MLM. I say that not to brag, because my story is surely not one of a fast starter, ha! But, it can be done.
  
  I am not a huge fan of "Funded Proposals" the way they are typically taught to be marketed. I am, however, a fan of taking the "coaching" approach. I have a lot of people who buy my ebooks to learn the system of internet marketing.
  
  I do not contact them ever and try to "back end" them into my program, but very often, they contact me. They want someone who will coach them.
  
  I have used this approach with other training concepts and affiliate programs, but I NEVER spend time promoting them outside of what I would do with a newsletter blast or something like that.
  
  I certainly don't call people and say - "If I could show you a way....."
  
  And try to sell them someone else's program.
  
  Hope that helps!
  
  EXPECT Success!
  
  Jackie Ulmer
  
  Thanks
  
  1 reply
  
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  JackieUlmer 16 years ago
  
  In response to David's Post -
  
  _____________________________________________
  
  Now before anyone starts ripping on me...
  _____________________________________________
  
  ...let me ask you.
  
  Have you built a team of 8,000 reps in a non-internet based
  network marketing company?
  
  --Yes, I have done this both offline and online
  
  Have you made over $1 million in network marketing?
  
  --Yes, and I did it marketing ALL online. I did not do so with my offline company (more on that below!)
  
  Have you been doing it full time for over 3 years?
  
  --Yes!!!
  
  If not, you're probably not qualified to dispute what I'm
  trying to teach you because you simply don't have the
  experience.
  
  Stop messing around with other people's lead generation systems.
  
  Go out to your warm market. If you're not willing to do that, then
  network marketing is probably not for you.
  
  --David, I agree that one should ALWAYS use the notification principle with their warm market list. We should not go after people the way many did in the 90s, but instead notify, use third party approach (who do you know) and go from there.
  
  --The Internet is just another great way (like BNI offline) to build relationships and generate a whole new warm market. It is for making contacts and then the phone needs to take over.
  
  --The Internet will NEVER do it all. It can't and shouldn't. It's a robot. It's got to be High Tech, High TOUCH.
  
  --And, people need to be taught HOW to use the Internet. In other words, don't do online what you wouldn't do offline. You wouldn't walk into a party, shouting through a megaphone about how great your products and opportunity is. Don't do this online. For some reason, people think that it doesn't turn people off online. It would certainly be a turnoff offline, so why not the same online? People are STILL people!
  
  Use the Internet like any other tool, because it has amazing power, when done RIGHt!
  
  Thanks
  
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Charles Harper

16 years ago

ER:

I can see both sides.

I think that you need to be your own Mike Dillard.

My opinion, write your own funded proposal system. It is not that hard when you think about it. The point is to get them into your funnel.

If you use ANY other funded proposal system, you will be on their autorresponder and yours. And if they attracted you in the first place, who do you think they are going to listen to? Who has more authority, them or you? My bet is them.

How many times do you see MLM Lead System Pro and some dudes don't even bother to change the copy? That makes them leaders that I want to follow?

If you are challenged in writing one, PM me, and I will write and create one for specifically for you. You can use it for the people you attract and your prospects will get one set of messages.

Why go through all the trouble of getting traffic and share the list with somebody else?

Charles

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Loren Woirhaye

16 years ago

Exactly Charles. Dillard is smart - he has the power.

When you use his system you don't get the same power.
You pay the advertising bill and he collects power whether you
succeed or fail.

As long as your business model is built around promoting an
affiliate site and somebody else's name you are in a position
of weakness. When you own the system you promote it to
build your own power. As long as prospects know it is not
of your creation your leadership power is fragile.

I maybe should not even write this here. I don't want
too many people knowing this is the way it really works.

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David Frey 16 years ago

I can speak with authority about this because I DO in fact, make a large
sum of money each month from my network marketing business.

I'm the #2 money earner in my company. I've been the #2 money earner
for 3 years and running. I'm the all-time #1 recruiter.

I highly recommend to people who want to be successful in network
marketing to reach out to their family and friends in the first 90 days
of joining a business.

As much as you don't want to hear that, it's proven time and again, that
tapping into existing relationships by reaching out to people that you
already know is the absolute fastest way to start your business.

When you eventually run through your entire warm market list, you should
then start working through the warm market list of the people that you've
brought into the business.

Doing these two things in your first year will help you become successful.

__________________________________________________ ___________

Here's what happens to people who rely on the internet and templated
lead generation systems to generate leads...
__________________________________________________ ____________

They get heavily involved in the internet marketing part of the business
and eventually lose interest in and drop out of their primary business.

I've seen this happen again, and again, and again, and again...FIRST HAND.

There is a significant educational process and ramp up to learn online lead
generation. It takes skills.

Skills which are NOT duplicateable.

Not even the simplest internet marketing systems are duplicateable because
they all require some level of technical capability.

__________________________________________________

Have you ever heard of the "Grandma Nadine Rule"
__________________________________________________ _

The Grandma Nadine Rule states that if your grandma can't
do it, it's not duplicateable.

Network Marketing is all about getting LOTS of people to do
4 simple steps.

1. Ask people if they're interested in making some extra money.

2. Giving them a CD, DVD, report, online video or some 3rd party
tool to watch or read.

3. Asking them if they have any questions and then signing them
up.

4. Teaching the person you signed up to do step 1-3 over and
over again.

__________________________________________________ __

Now if you're dead set on using the internet to prospect...
__________________________________________________ __

Do this...

1. Create your own 60 minute audio CD that has something
to do with your primary business.

2. Create a landing page and get people to request it.

3. Send them the CD and follow up with them.

But you know, what I've just told you is NOT duplicateable
and the people you bring in will say, "How can I make that
CD like you did?" and you'll be spending most of your time
helping people make CD's rather than introducing the business
to other people.

_____________________________________________

Now before anyone starts ripping on me...
_____________________________________________

...let me ask you.

Have you built a team of 8,000 reps in a non-internet based
network marketing company?

Have you made over $1 million in network marketing?

Have you been doing it full time for over 3 years?

If not, you're probably not qualified to dispute what I'm
trying to teach you because you simply don't have the
experience.

Stop messing around with other people's lead generation systems.

Go out to your warm market. If you're not willing to do that, then
network marketing is probably not for you.

All the best.

David Frey
MarketingBestPractices .com

P.S. With that said...if you're dead set on using the internet for
prospecting. Stop doing network marketing. Focus on internet
marketing for at least 1 year. Build a list that loves you. THEN
introduce your network marketing business. But don't try to do
both at the same time. It's a recipe for going no where.
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megaplex

16 years ago

Cetting Flipped,

these guru's say hey dont promote your company promote yourself and I'll show you how, jsut promote me and my guru stuff instead.

So now instead of promoting your company or even promoteing yourself you end up promoting the Guru's and his stuff.

There needs to be some way of addressing this Guru flip.

Promoting the company is ok but companies come and go and we also come and go from companies. So there is a lot of advertising leverage the companies gain for free.

Promoting the Guru is ok but Guru's come and go and we also follow and un follow Guru's. So there is a lot of advertising leverage the Guru's gian for free at our expence.

Surely there's a work around here, between the three parties,

You
Guru
Company

No mastter something has to change because the Guru's and the companies are laughing all the way to the bank.

M

Originally Posted by Loren Woirhaye

Exactly Charles. Dillard is smart - he has the power.

When you use his system you don't get the same power.
You pay the advertising bill and he collects power whether you
succeed or fail.

As long as your business model is built around promoting an
affiliate site and somebody else's name you are in a position
of weakness. When you own the system you promote it to
build your own power. As long as prospects know it is not
of your creation your leadership power is fragile.

I maybe should not even write this here. I don't want
too many people knowing this is the way it really works.

Thanks
1 reply

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cscarpero

15 years ago

There is a way to address it, actually. Use the system, but change the landing page. It's the best of both worlds.

Originally Posted by megaplex

Cetting Flipped,

these guru's say hey dont promote your company promote yourself and I'll show you how, jsut promote me and my guru stuff instead.

So now instead of promoting your company or even promoteing yourself you end up promoting the Guru's and his stuff.

There needs to be some way of addressing this Guru flip.

Promoting the company is ok but companies come and go and we also come and go from companies. So there is a lot of advertising leverage the companies gain for free.

Promoting the Guru is ok but Guru's come and go and we also follow and un follow Guru's. So there is a lot of advertising leverage the Guru's gian for free at our expence.

Surely there's a work around here, between the three parties,

You
Guru
Company

No mastter something has to change because the Guru's and the companies are laughing all the way to the bank.

M

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AjAllDay

Banned 16 years ago

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Charles Harper

16 years ago

Originally Posted by AjAllDay

Hey everybody!! I'm having trouble deciding which system to go with. I 'm currently on both systems and been through all of the trainings for each one. I plug into the training calls for each system as well. I'm more involved with MLM LEAD SYSTEM PRO because I set my aweber account up and set my 1st campaign up. However, I'm having a really hard time in deciding which ststem to go with. If anyone with "experience" has any insight they could share with me in helping me decide, it would be highly appreciated. For example, which system is better now and why?? Which system do you think will be better in the future and why?? Once again, I highly appreciate it. Thanks so much.

That is simple,dude. Whichever one helps you to put the most people in your business.

Having said that, David Frey is the 800 pound gorilla in one particular opportunity I know of. I think he has valuable insight.

I would say my insight is valuable too in my above post (IMHO)

Charles

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TerryMil

16 years ago

David Frey what is the MLM company you are with?

Thanks

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hk

16 years ago

Great Insight, David. Thank you!

I have been doing internet marketing (mainly as an affiliate) for 6 years and made a few million dollars. Have been thinking about entering MLM on net, but decided not to do so after reading David's post. Thanks.

Thanks

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ethan97

16 years ago

With all due respect to David...

- there are internet-based MLM prospecting systems that anyone with desire can step right into and succeed without a significant ramp-up to learn online lead generation, but they are proprietary and used strictly within the groups that created them and are not for sale (to my knowledge) outside the particular organizations

- I personally know three people who are full-time in network marketing and have easily made over $1 million in the business. Two of the three built large organizations largely online, the third built about half of his business online. Nothing wrong with learning how to build locally, belly to belly, but it isn't the end all and is not required for success.

I think David is keenly aware that 95% or more of the "build your MLM online" stuff is garbage and will lead down a path to failure. His insights are valuable. This does not mean, however, that a successful business can't be built online - it just takes exceptional leadership with solid training and tools.

Thanks

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spooon

Banned 16 years ago

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Joseph Riley

16 years ago

Thanks for the original question and insightful posts.

This very question is something that I have spent a bit of time researching recently. I can say that I'm not a fan of either system now because of my research.

My main objections are that using these systems you are actually branding someone else more so than yourself - yes with either system you can put your own video on the page and hopefully you would be able to change all the wording to show your personality as a leader ideally.

But in my research very few do - these pages are instantly recognizable as a replicated page 100's or 1000's of them saying exactly the same thing at the same time teaching the reader not to promote their mlm company directly because of the replicated page effect lol

They do at a basic level provide some basic education in internet marketing concepts - training boot camps so i guess that would be a plus for some.

Another thing that turned me off was the impression given that this was attraction marketing couldn't really feel the love myself.

The auto-responder messages that I received from people using the MLMLSP system really stunned me so much that I would give them a 5 star rating as the best rejection repulsion marketing of all time.

here is one subject line Im sure you've seen this before tho
==========================================
Congratulations Joseph, You've Just Made A Commission!
==========================================
Well guess what when I opened that email there were no payment details when i checked my paypal and affiliate accounts also no payments received from you, should I send you an invoice reminder

Guess what you great attraction marketing expert - You have just lied to me and I no longer find you attractive - you've lost my respect.

Another amazing subject line that totally blew me away was -
=================================================
Get off my list Joseph if you won't trade $1.00 for YOUR Success!
=================================================

Hmmmm such difficult choices a moral dilemma could anyone here
help me

For now I have decided to stay on that list not that I would ever join this program or anything recommended just for the comedy relief

I have recieved the same email series from others using this system seems that people being lazy will just plug in the same auto-responder series without even reading it or thinking to change them to truly reflect their own personality - that is not attraction marketing that is copycat lazy marketing - IMHO

A wonderfully simple solution if you want to get all your mlm or new business partners really trained up would be to send them to warriorforum just one hour a day here reading the posts and asking serious questions will get them trained up very very quickly.

Best wishes and the very best of success with whatever you decide to do

Thanks
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Eldon Beard

16 years ago

Originally Posted by Joseph Riley

My main objections are that using these systems you are actually branding someone else more so than yourself - yes with either system you can put your own video on the page and hopefully you would be able to change all the wording to show your personality as a leader ideally.

But in my research very few do - these pages are instantly recognizable as a replicated page 100's or 1000's of them saying exactly the same thing at the same time teaching the reader not to promote their mlm company directly because of the replicated page effect lol

They do at a basic level provide some basic education in internet marketing concepts - training boot camps so i guess that would be a plus for some.

Hello Joseph,

That's the big problem. Most people using these systems are drawn to the "attraction marketing" idea, but are too lazy to customize things to fit their own personality and style. I hate to be that blunt, but it's reality. They don't understand that these replicated pages become very recognizable very quickly...and they end up looking like amateurs. Just the opposite of what they hoped.

The good news is, those who are willing to take the time to learn the concepts and create their own identity and position themselves as leaders will be the winners. Attraction marketing, in concept, is very solid. You can't get by, though, with a lazy approach.

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Loren Woirhaye 16 years ago

I get "friended" on a daily basis by networkers on YouTube -
almost all with videos about attraction marketing and telling
me about what great leaders they are and how great they
are at internet marketing = and I click on their websites
(yeah, I Do!) and they are all... the same.

Except for the video.

And my reaction is "oh, that."

Hardly "personal branding" in my opinion.
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PowerOfOne

16 years ago

haha, very funny thread.

Lots of opinions. Not as many facts or understandings
of what these systems actually are.

But hey... to each their own.

Jonathan

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tush

16 years ago

I highly recommend to people who want to be successful in network
marketing to reach out to their family and friends in the first 90 days
of joining a business.

As much as you don't want to hear that, it's proven time and again, that
tapping into existing relationships by reaching out to people that you
already know is the absolute fastest way to start your business.

When you eventually run through your entire warm market list, you should
then start working through the warm market list of the people that you've
brought into the business.

Doing these two things in your first year will help you become successful.

David, this strategy is very dangerous. I must confess that I failed at it miserably. As Ann Sieg puts it, " A Prospect who comes to you is infinitely more qualified than any one you would ever approach yourself". The problem is most distributors are not even trained on how to approach their friends and family. What they do is to tell every one how great their products are... they appear like sales men desperate to make a quick buck....

I have done network marketing using both methods, but I regret the time I wasted using old school tactics.

The internet is huge. The cake is big. This is the time for everyone to get their portion. What a joy is to open your mail box every morning and you find a hot lead interested in your business!

Many network marketers are getting it wrong. They just lead with funded proposals. This is very dangerous. These proposals have their place but one should first provide value. Their main proble is that they are branding sone one else. Besides, people are different. There is no system which is duplicatable.... The key to succeed online is to find your niche and target this market. be yourself. Provide value, build relationships, and recommend whatever you have after you have established this relationships. No wonder, even google doesn't like these replicated pages. That is why many have been affected by the "Google slap".

Network marketing is a real business. Those who are looking for an easy way out will soon be wiped out!

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Loren Woirhaye

16 years ago

Originally Posted by tush

Many network marketers are getting it wrong. They just lead with funded proposals. This is very dangerous. These proposals have their place but one should first provide value. Their main proble is that they are branding sone one else. Besides, people are different. There is no system which is duplicatable.... The key to succeed online is to find your niche and target this market. be yourself. Provide value, build relationships, and recommend whatever you have after you have established this relationships. No wonder, even google doesn't like these replicated pages. That is why many have been affected by the "Google slap".

This is correct Tush - in my experience. Funded proposals have their place but
can also chase-off some of the best prospects by trying to strong-arm them
into paying "application fees" and so forth. Joe Schroeder gets it as close to
right as anybody - but his style is obfuscatory and that is a problem with using
his stuff if you don't want that vibe in your marketing.

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Robert_Rand

16 years ago

Jonathan Budd's System - hands down.

You are getting RED HOT, PROVEN copy for $47/mo and it's completely branded to you and your business.

99% of people who see your page will have never seen it.

It really is like buying the rights to proven sales material from a 6 figure monthly earner.. not sure how you can beat that...

I'm not currently in MLM but let's just say I've been around the block.

Jonathan Budd is the man and there's a reason he's quietly taking over this industry...

http://siteanalytics.compete.com/mag...com/?metric=uv

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Loren Woirhaye

16 years ago

so you aren't a customer (since you aren't "in MLM")
... but you are happy to enthusiastically
pimp the product as the best thing ever?

...interesting...

If YOU feel it's a good value - go ahead and join and
do what they say - then you'll know for sure.

There are many layers of illusion in internet marketing -
and while success leaves traces they are not always
simple to read accurately.

Thanks

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Craig Fenton

16 years ago

Hi ER70275:

Hope you are well today. If you decide to go with any of the products you mentioned or other sites please be careful of their cancellation clause.

Yesterday while researching a product a site offered 1 dollar trial for a month with auto renewal after but if you want to cancel they put in the agreement you must do so 10 or more days before the next month or you are charged the full amount. This is throughout the time you join.

If a product is good it should stand on it's own. Even if the value is average, you should be able to withdraw membership 1 minute before a new month begins and not have to pay, or even fight with the vendor/PayPal/bank for a refund.

Please choose wisely and good luck!

Thanks
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cscarpero 15 years ago

I'm in the same company as David Frey. I do agree with him on many points he had mentioned, but I have some differences to pick with him. He forgot to mention that his sponsor (who is actally my sponsor) has an account with Mr. Budd's system and has done quite well with sponsoring people online. The guy above him has a MLSP account (he got me into MLSP as well). Yes, even the top leadership of network marketing companies disagrees on this.

I will agree with him about warm market. People should do that, but as a start. Most of us eventually do run out of warm market and these systems do provide another way to do business.

Are they for everybody? Absolutely not! I happen to have been online for over 10 years and own an insane amount of websites, so this stuff is not a big deal. I have people on my team who ask about using these systems and the first thing I ask is how comfortable they are with blog building, article marketing etc. If they know very little about this stuff I encourage them to do things the offline way.

By the way, I also feel that "duplication" is a myth. So, doing something because it does or doesn't "duplciate" is silly. What works for one does not work for others. Each of us has to find our own path to success. Our job as sponsors is to guide our distributor into what path is best for them.
- Thanks
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I'm an online marketer and mortgage loan officer.

Connect with me at www.Scarpero.com
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tush

15 years ago

So now instead of promoting your company or even promoteing yourself you end up promoting the Guru's and his stuff.

There needs to be some way of addressing this Guru flip.

Promoting the company is ok but companies come and go and we also come and go from companies. So there is a lot of advertising leverage the companies gain for free.

Promoting the Guru is ok but Guru's come and go and we also follow and un follow Guru's. So there is a lot of advertising leverage the Guru's gian for free at our expence.

Surely there's a work around here, between the three parties,

You
Guru
Company

We just need balance here. I have discovered that promoting each of these things have their own place in the overall success of a person. Leveraging off gurus and their systems helps you to gain credibility and make some money as you learn how these things work. As we know, it takes time to make significant amounts of residual income. This helps most distributors to stay in positive cash flow.

But the truth is, there is no system which is duplicable. What we should do is to present all options to people so that each one chooses a method that works for them. Yes, even offline works if that is what you like and you know how to use the consultative approach.

Thanks

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www.AnnetteTush.com

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cscarpero

15 years ago

By the way, most MLM companies are getting strict about what you can say about them online. They can and will make you delete your Squidoo lenses, Hubpages etc. One more reason to promote yourself!

Thanks
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I'm an online marketer and mortgage loan officer.

Connect with me at www.Scarpero.com

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David Frey

15 years ago

Online systems can help you recruit.

Recruiting is the easy part.

But making them stick and work the business over a long period
of time (i.e. 5+ years) is the key.

And normally, if someone has come to you through the internet,
they will leave you through the internet.

The top people in my organization were people I knew on a personal
basis or that were introduced to the business through a personal
friend.

Only one leader in my organization came to me through the internet
and he had been on my newsletter list for years.

I was sitting in a lecture given my Randy Gage one day and he drew
this chart on the board.

The chart showed a strong upswing in the first two years, then a
steady line representing no growth for a year and then a line swinging
straight down.

He explained that when you bring people in through the internet, you'll
have two or so great years and then you'll experience a period of stagnant
growth and then people will start dropping out like flies.

I've found that to absolutely correct.

So for all you who have been using replicated online lead generation systems
to build your network marketing business, good luck.

You'll experience short term success, but in the long run, you will struggle.

I'm talking to the group collectively and not individually.

David

P.S. And to Carlos' point, I believe that duplication is 80% people and 20% systems.
Find the "right" people and you'll duplicate. But in the end, you DO NEED a very
simple system that EVERYONE on your team can do (and not everyone can do
internet marketing).

Thanks

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mentor_nz

Banned 15 years ago

[DELETED]

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David Frey

15 years ago

Originally Posted by mentor_nz

Hi David,

I am wondering if you are just looking at it from the point of view of recruiting.

See what Randy Gage might have forgotten to tell you are some of the very top Agel people left including Randy Shcrotier (I might of spelt that wrong) because the opportunity wasn't that lucrative among other reasons.

If people feel valued and appreciated and are making money, why would they leave?

So what I am trying to point out here is I believe it's not about the way people join an opportunity, it's what we do after they have joined.

Warmly,
~ David

How someone joins an opportunity is one of several determining factors that go
into why a person stays or quits.

If a person joins because they found the opportunity on the internet, the chances
of them getting bombarded with other opportunities is very high. And the chances
of them getting lured away into other opportunities is equally high.

This is especially true in internet marketing in which there are no limits to the amount
of hype that people spew out of their sales letters (if you question that, just go read
a few WSO's).

People leave MLM (and other business opportunities) for a number of reasons.

In MLM, you'll often get paid a very little amount of money up front while you're
building your organization and retail base.

If you stay consistent, over time, you'll get paid ridiculous amounts of money.

It's no different than building a sales team in which you receive overrides. The bigger
the sales team you build, the more sales overrides you'll enjoy.

But most people don't have the fortitude and faith to hang in long enough to build
a large organization. Those that do get rewarded handsomly.

It's no different in internet marketing.

The internet marketers who PAY THE PRICE to educate themselves and move
through their failures ("tests" as I like to call them) get rewarded handsomly as well.

It's true in ANY business.

The basic fact is that MLM is just like any other business opportunity.

The factors that go into making someone a success in one business opportunity
are the same factors that go into making someone a success in MLM.

David Frey

Thanks

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mentor_nz Banned 15 years ago

[DELETED]

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- cscarpero 15 years ago
  
  Well, after 4 months I decided to give up on MLSP. I generated a little over 100 leads and made ZERO money with it. They try to get people to use PPC but fail to mention that PPC traffic for MLM is rediculously expensive. I'm a full time PPC marketer and even I couldn't get it to work out. The newbies are screwed!
  
  SEO isn't much better for this. Lot of competition.
  
  I'm converting to using my own blogs, my own opt in, my own list. Promoting Mike Dillard on the backend. Saves me the $50/mo.
  
  Thanks
  
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  I'm an online marketer and mortgage loan officer.
  
  Connect with me at www.Scarpero.com
  
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tush

15 years ago

David wrote:

Network Marketing is all about getting LOTS of people to do
4 simple steps.

1. Ask people if they're interested in making some extra money.

2. Giving them a CD, DVD, report, online video or some 3rd party
tool to watch or read.

3. Asking them if they have any questions and then signing them
up.

4. Teaching the person you signed up to do step 1-3 over and
over again.

__________________________________________________ __

Now if you're dead set on using the internet to prospect...
__________________________________________________ __

Do this...

1. Create your own 60 minute audio CD that has something
to do with your primary business.

2. Create a landing page and get people to request it.

3. Send them the CD and follow up with them.

But you know, what I've just told you is NOT duplicateable
and the people you bring in will say, "How can I make that
CD like you did?" and you'll be spending most of your time
helping people make CD's rather than introducing the business
to other people.

David, you make very good points here. It is good to give people options and they see what works for them. Personally, model one never worked for me. I can say that I have found model two(internet marketing) a better choice for me.

There is one thing I have noticed about systems.... it takes time to build your primary business. But the immediate cash flow you make is a good thing. What people really need is to focus on their opportunity, set up a funnel customized to that opportunity. In that case, they will attract prospects who are really targeted.

Annette

Thanks

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wiplash1

15 years ago

Personally, I am not a real big fan of cookie cutter systems with all kinds of extra tools inside that you have to purchase to be successful with the various systems. I do however feel that if you take a great tool from Clickbank or Amazon such as an ebook or piece of software and create a squeeze page, mind you a very simple one, you can have much luck with it. This will put networkers on your list that will be looking for more valuable offers. Target specifics and get them onto your list. If you create a nice squeeze page to advertise in Twitter and the social networks to put people on your list, and you earn from your offers, you have the ability to build credibility because you offered a product that helped people do better with their business. With the added credibility, the people on your list can view offers that you have anytime, anywhere. I would not use a cookie cutter system, but I would use a blog as your self branding platform. I have a website from my starting point in the industry. Now that it is getting free traffic from the search engines, I am seeing my list grow on autopilot. You can put an opt in form on almost any blog. Another thing that you can do to make money on the front end is offer your autoresponder affiliate link so that you can share any campaigns. I also add my Skype link to my emails so that I could directly build relationships with my people to create my own warm market.
I have created about 200 warm market people that I can just say hello to at any time and see how they are doing. The bottom line is that you have to build the relationships. I get about 10 people per week added to my Skype list and those tend to be people that are even more hungry then those that are just receiving my follow up messages.

The bottom line is that Internet marketing has little bearing on the program that you are a part of. Internet marketing involves how well you can solve a problem that people have with their business without being too pushy. Personally, I don't mind having the people come through my funnel that are on a lot of other lists. Those people are the most hungry and their budget is low. If you can show them how to build a budget, they now view you as an expert.

For the newbie deciding on which system is the best, I would pick neither because you need to examine the profit/loss situation. Most programs make you make extra purchases or join other programs that may not be affordable for the average newbie. Personally, I like GDI because it is only 10 dollars per month and it is easily duplicated.
I also use Traffic Wave as my autoresponder because it has a great compensation plan and they have always delivered my emails successfully. For 28 dollars per month, an individual can have two great affiliate programs that will assist you to sell any niche products and build a list. It is so simple. Then use the various marketing techniques and be available to your team so that they could use your marketing techniques.

Thanks

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Hecman104

15 years ago

You hear this story time and time again..

...after trying the offline marketing methods, there was just nowhere to go but the internet.. I was introduced to internet marketing after reading magnetic sponsoring and actually used the Mastermind System for 2 months because, of course.. i wanted to generate leads but I also wanted everything done for me.. it just seemed so easy..

I'm not gonna bash the systems.. I think they're both very helpful and can both be used *by newbies* for lead generating purposes.. but of course, besides the training and the 'done-for-you' capture pages.. there is a hidden agenda..

and i think a lot of people, who have gone through it, see it now. There's nothing in that system that you can't do on your own so you're basically paying for training and hosting...

It's an ingenious system if you think about it. Train your paying customers to promote your system for you. The MLM SYSTEM FORMULA..<-- the last 94 copies were sold a couple of weeks ago..

Thanks

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Randy Chambliss

15 years ago

MLM Lead System Pro Hands down. Here are some benefits...

1) Branded Websites
2) Control Of Your List
3) Branded Training Center To Give To Your Prospects
4) Over A Dozen Affiliate Programs
5) Over $20k Of Marketing Training From Top Internet Marketers

Personally I Promote my Blog on the front end and uses my MLSP optin list to build my list. The reason I do this is to stand out from the other MLSP members. You have to be creative. However, make sure your giving away a lot of value.

Visit my blog at NewBusinessLeadsNow dot Com

Thanks
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tush 15 years ago

I have discovered one thing..... these systems help one to learn the skills. If you can manage to refer people to these systems and make some money, then you can also market your opportunity on line. We must agree that there is a learning curve for each and every person when they are starting any venture depending on where they are coming from.... so these systems help out and enable people to make money as they learn.

As for MLM Lead System Pro, recently, I am not a very big fan here is why... Of recent, I happen to be on certain lists and they basically use this tool. It is annoying to get the exact same message from different people, all claiming that the message/training is theirs.... :rolleyes::confused: I wld rather know you are recommending some one's system.....
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MLM Lead System Pro vs. Online MLM Mastermind System??

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