Selling 'Make Money Online' Unethical?

It all depends on what products you promote. I have been in that niche since I started my business in 2008 and it's been extremely profitable for me. Of course, I physically review every product I promote, and I don't promote products that teach you how to make money online per se.

I promote products that are tools to help you with your online business, whatever niche you may be in. For instance, WordPress plugins, YouTube software, PLR reseller packages, etc.

I agree that there are a lot of people in the MMO niche who are very shady, though.

Still, I don't see a problem with the niche if it's done ethically.

OP, it IS unethical and it is technically illegal (see: cash gifting). Of course, the drones here will justify their actions, and the actions of others, any way that they can. You can't reason with liars, sociopaths, or narcissists, of which IM is largely comprised of.

Also, your signature is noble, but it won't help you sell anything. There is a reason why there is a superfluity of BS online...it's because it sells. Truth is ugly...lies are beautiful. Thems the breaks. I'm on your side...but it's the losing side.

Welcome to the make money online world.

99% of the people teaching how to make money online don't have the first clue how to do it.

They read a few ebooks from "gurus" that tell them to sell what they learned in the ebook, which is total garbage itself. It's a vicious cycle with no end in site.

I, for one, have found great value in some of the "make money online" products that I have purchased. To say, or even suggest, that all products in this niche are unethical or have no value is far, far, far from the truth.

Marketers have to learn their craft somehow and not all can afford personal mentors or coaches. So they buy ebooks, courses, memberships, and other info products to learn what they need to know.

I agree that there are many very poor and some worthless "make money" products for sale . . . you simply have to stay away from those.

As is always the case . . . buyer beware! You are responsible for your own due diligence prior to making any purchase.

I have a problem with sellers in the "make money online" niche who are faking it or trying to teach without having personal successful experience selling online . . . but there are some very legitimate 6- and 7- figure earners that are sharing what they do. Why should this concern you?

Steve

Not all MMO products.Niches.

I do agree when it is teaching a Coach how to be a coach who turns around and teaches others how to be a Coach who then turns around and yet again teaches others how to teach others how to be a Coach etc..etc..

That is just a viscous cycle that really offers NO intrinsic value.

But on the other hand MMO Niches like teaching others Email Marketing in the weight loss industry or providing SEO Services to a Mom and POP store on Main St. is NOT unethical, imo !!


- Robert Andrew

OP, You have a very valid point. It's totally unethical. All hype, no one provides any real way to make money online.

You have tricked one person, now he will not fall prey again to your offers. But the fresh set of people are always ready to fall prey to the glamorous good for nothing products.

It becomes very difficult to trust the 1% legitimate people who really teach good stuff about making money online.

At the end of the day, every action will have an equal and opposite reaction. If you earn money in an unethical way you lose it as easily as you made it.

After all, there is a difference between street peddlers who never gain any trust and never grow into big businesses. And there are businesses which provide great service and gain their customers trust and grow into large businesses.

BTW, your thought of the day was very motivating.

You're articulating one of the best ways to make money online: Your own experience.

The idea of making money from your kitchen table while all your neighbors are shoveling snow out their driveways so they won't be late for work is very alluring a lot of people.

No doubt, the percentage of people who actually become self-supporting while doing this is small, but that doesn't mean that money can't be made nor does it mean that you can't eventually become self-supporting over time.

And it certainly doesn't mean that because a lot of people have had bad experiences that all the marketing courses online are scams. Happy to have you chime in but, you articulate a familiar refrain around here. Don't take all the bad apples as a reflection of the industry as a whole.

The other refrain you read around here is that the ones who make it have taken some lumps, but have kept their eyes on the prize. Those bad experiences (and I have had my share) become guidelines as to who to trust and who to avoid.

I don't know who said it, but I'm sure someone around here must have said that if making money online were so easy, the Warrior Forum would become the next Facebook.

This is a rather round-about way of hoping you don't become too discouraged, continue your search and keep an open mind.

Thanks for all your comments. I'm happy I'm not the only one. I agree that selling tools and word-press plugins etc does not fall under the same category. I think people easily stray into a grey area often though. I nearly did but found myself feeling dirty. This feeling prompted this post. It's tempting because it's a path of least resistance.

It depends. Not all products are equal. I'm getting ready to sell an ebook about how to make money as a freelance writer - mostly working online. It's a real business. I don't see how that is unethical. Some people just need a nudge in the right direction and that's what I'm offering.

Yes, there are some very dubious products out there that are scams. But just because it's about making money online doesn't necessarily mean it's unethical.

I think it largely boils down to what you're selling, and how you sell it.

If you're selling a product (your own or an affiliate offer) that teaches information which does not work, that's unethical.

If you're selling a product that teaches information that DOES work, and is valuable to someone who implements it, I don't see any ethical issue there.

If you're selling a product based on lies, even if it's a good product in itself, I consider that unethical.

Simply put, you should only sell something that lives up to what it promises and avoid deceitful marketing practices.

Of course, this goes without saying but many (if not most) of the products in the make money online space are overhyped, misleading, or just present damaging advice.

I consider myself fortunate to have mostly invested in only high quality products that are actually worth what I paid.

Regards,
Daniel

I have to disagree with you. Just because you are selling a product as an affiliate
does not mean that you are the teacher.
Offline, it would look like this... You recommend a service and you are paid referral fee.
Nothing new.

I mean after reading your post 2x to make sure I understood what you believe is unethical, I do agree MLM's pushing recruitment commissions stacked upon a cheesy piece of regurgitated PLR (private label rights product) that has no REAL value is unethical.

Also, selling from a prospective without knowledge or proof is also unethical.

However, I have to DEFEND a large portion of the MMO (make money online) community, not because I currently make money selling these items, but because I have learned "How to" make money through such products.

If you go over to Clickbank and look at "The Truth About Six Pack Abs" - Mike Geary has made millions selling a cheap eBook, and much of his success centers on the marketing practices techniques, training and building affiliate associates and JV Partners... all of which consists of making money online practices, procedures, processes, and systems. People who sell and teach proven systems, and the process are in fact, providing a service, albeit it's through a digital book, video, or digital form of media.

How many bad books have you read offline?

How many movies repulsed you that someone actually wasted your time making such crap?

This is not limited to online...it's everywhere!

So, what's the difference if Mike Geary makes millions, as long as his customers receive value, solutions, knowledge, etc...

The same applies to EVERY niche market, I don't care if your a PIMP or Selling a course on How I made 12 Million doing email marketing, as Anik just released. Most "ethical" marketers offer 30-60-or-90 Money-back Guarantees, and will often "Over-Deliver" sharing trade secrets.

O.K. so let's say you work in a Corporate environment... yeah, it may seem impractical, unethical, and down-right unorthodox to witness people actually selling others information... because in the Brick n' Mortar setting giving away your secrets, might replace your ass with a younger, better looking, energetic employee...

But, in this "ARENA" anything goes... which does often introduce some scumbags, con-artists, and spammers, etc.

However, in the right environment, even prostitution can be conducted ethically.

If you want to talk about unethical... watch the politicians, if you think MMO is bad, these political leaders make me sick! - They sell and sow more lies than the Pope does Bibles.

IMHO... I believe, any area of life be it relationships, business, family, etc... should be conducted more ethically, and yet, the world in and of itself... is occupied by "us" ignorant human beings... How ever could we hope for the opportunity to be any greater to educate ourselves than through 'personal experience' and goodwill... and the internet (and digital media, virtual real estate) is that vessel...so, of course, people are buying "How to's" and "What Not's" it's the wave of the future, and it's here today!

You see the cup 1/2 empty as many jumped on your bandwagon... but, I see this cup overflowing to the tune of $670 BILLION DOLLARS... tap into it, ethically, of course!

All the Best,

Art

Who told you to do that exactly? I would want some names....

Oh, and I DO teach people how to make money online, and NO, this is not because I'm not making money with what i'm teaching (Kindle), it is because I want to make MORE money.

I actually don't see the logic here.

All the people that teach boxing don't know how to box?
All the people that teach English don't know how to speak english?
All the people teaching mathematics don't know how to do math?

??

Again, the reason most people don't make money is because their mindset is so weak. Just look at how you think. You are your worst own enemy.

You have not even convinced that this stuff work and this is why you come here and create this thread. You want evidences that it doesn't work to back up your limiting belief.

The truth is this: Most people that teach how to make money online with a method DO KNOW what they are talking about. They decide to teach other people because first of all, helping other people is fun and also, the how to make money online market is huge so there is a lot of money to be made in that niche. Does that mean they don't know what they are talking about? No.

A marketer that runs a real business knows what he's doing: Providing Real and High Value Information and Products to customers.

In the MMO niche it shouldn't be any different, however it is, in fact IMO 95% of the products are BS.

So the OP woke up on a crusade to try and stop unethical persons selling BS , guess he does not live in the real world

Next time you get a call form some person in India trying to get your details so they can help you maybe try talking to them

Where there is a buck to be made there will always be a scammer

Jason

Do I find that particular practice unethical?

Absolutely.

Do I find it strange?

Not at all.

Variations of that scam have been circulating long before Al Gore invented the Interwebz.

Pick up a copy of Popular Mechanics or Field & Stream from the early 1960s, and thumb back to the little three-line classifieds in the back. I can pretty much guarantee you that you'll find an ad for "how to make money placing cheap 3-line ads" or "how to make money stuffing envelopes."

If you sent in your money, you got back a mimeographed sheet saying "place the following ad..."

Have to differ with this statement, Art. If you made an agreement to trade your time for wages, your hours at the time were worth exactly what you agreed to accept. You may have felt that you were worth more, especially in hindsight, but at the time your time was worth what you agreed to accept for it.

Basic commerce - anything is only worth what a buyer will pay for it.

And yes, we've all done it. We just need to face the fact that unless someone had a literal gun to our head, we entered the transaction of our own free will.

There was some idiot who put up a thread asking this "If I nave no exp in IM can I teach IM " and some of the answers were ludicrous

But as they say it takes all kinds or people would not get scammed every day , paint the picture and they fall for dream but not the nightmare!

Jason

If you are just teaching people to ask others for money, then yes, that's just not smart.

If you are teaching people real ways to make money, then I don't see the problem with it?

If you sell 2 cupcakes online you can immediately make an eBook on how you did it and probably make more than you did selling the cupcakes!

That is just the nature of the beast.

Was it ethical for the girl scout to sell her cookies at the medicinal marijuana dispensary or just smart marketing?

-Art

Thank you for sharing the information here. Its much informative and really i got some valid information. You had posted the amazing article.

It's the current version of a "chain" letter. It's not new.

You mean like building a Dunkin Donuts across from the police station, or parking your food truck outside the Weight Watchers meeting?

If that person sold two cupcakes in two minutes, the title of the ebook would likely be something like "how to sell 60 cupcakes per hour."

Like the would-be Clickbank superstar teacher who sold one product by sheer luck, collected their $10 commission, and then claimed they made "$300 per day" by extending the math into fantasy land.

a very informative post

It depends on what your personal views are and how far you go. 99% of internet marketers who sell MMO products are very unethical (and in some cases, criminal). Just make sure what you are selling works as advertised - period.

There is nothing inherently wrong with selling "how to make money products." Making money is an incredibly popular topic. And many such products are useful and legitimate.

And not all "make money" products are about Internet marketing. For example, if you have a dog walking business and tell others how to do it, that's fine. It's legit.

HOWEVER... I get your point.

You're talking specifically about "Internet marketing" and "make money" products.

So -- to answer your question -- yes, for a total beginner to IM to create a course on how to make money before they have ever made any money is odd.

It's also completely unnecessary.

Because there are many, many niches beyond "making money." In fact, I would advise any IM newbie to avoid THREE topics: Internet marketing, miracle cures, and supplements.

In fact, the miracle cure and supplement niches are so problematic that I don't even write sales copy for them. I turn down people in those niches all the time.

Why?

Because the FTC and FDA don't like those products!

So... if you're a beginner, stick with something you know well and are passionate about. Dip your toe in the murky waters of Internet marketing before diving in head first. There are TONS of other profitable niches to explore.

John

I sell the business strategies that I use everyday in my business group to make money....

so you learn what it works because I use the same methods that I sell

I think what it comes down to is that there are legitimate products that teach you how to earn legitimate money online through freelance writing, graphic design, building Adsense sites, Amazon sites, email marketing, etc. Then there is a legitimate market for tools that help you make videos or help you curate content for your blog or help you find good keywords or create graphics, etc. These are the types of products I promote and have done very well with.

I didn't know very much about MLMs at all and recently I decided to give one a shot to see what it was all about (it's a popular one, but I won't mention any names). I was absolutely appalled at the whole setup of this thing.

The basic premise was that you were selling a membership to an "all in one marketing solution" that allowed you to build landing pages, collect emails, send emails, etc. First of all, the services that were offered was really sub-par, and yet they were marketing this site as "the only marketing system you'll ever need." They claimed you would no longer need web hosting, autoresponder, etc, because this site provided it all.

Well, come to find out the services were rinky dink, and the only real way to make money was to recruit people into the same crappy service, and then hope they started recruiting people under them because they paid "7 or 8 levels deep," which basically means in MLM speak is that you got a cut of everything that your referrals brought in.

As far as I'm concerned this should be outlawed, because all they are really selling you is the "opportunity" to resell their crappy product. The product is not really the money maker at all. The money maker is your ability to convince others to buy the crappy system and then start promoting it hard so you can skim off their hard work.

I was pretty disgusted and cancelled after one month. The funny thing is, because I am an experienced marketer and know how to sell, I actually started making decent money within the first month.

However, I quickly came to the conclusion that money means nothing if you have to compromise your morals to get it.

Mehn, i laughed so hard on this one. Very interested topic. I must say. Here's the solution i propose. When someone walks up to you to ask for money to teach you how to make money?
DO THIS > > > I will

I agree. I'm tired of rehashed unusable junk people are putting out. If you sell something the buyer should get some type of use out of it. If you offer something for money it should serve a useful purpose for the buyer.

I am not in the MMO niche but there are two types of products...

1. (fill in your own guess)% of MMO products are unethical scams or are simply worthless!

2. (fill in your own guess)% of MMO products are laser targeted and teach you how to make money online in at least one specific area. They are created and marketed by experienced, ethical, and successful people.

What makes the niche look so bad is that most newbies are enticed into creating and/or marketing product category #1 instead of #2. Why? Because the biggest part of the hype is how EASY and FAST it is to rake in LOTS of money. There is usually some secret loophole, etc...

Like the OP it used to really bother me. Well, it still does but there is nothing I can do about it. Some people will have to learn the hard way when they part with their money.

On the other hand... I know many people that are in the MMO niche that do it with integrity and professionalism. They have also helped many OTHER people start businesses and make good money in many OTHER niches. Some are good at helping people advance to the next level with their business through smart techniques and disciplined work.

It would be a mistake to throw everyone in the MMO niche into the sleazy buck chasing marketers that don't care who they take advantage of scenario. There are some incredibly smart and talented online business people that are also good at teaching others how to succeed.

Sometimes I will go to the Warriors looking to hire you when I have some spare time, nice way to give back to some of the newbies starting out and have a product up for WSO

So one warrior sent me the pm with the download link of his eBook and get to me blah blah
what amazes me is that A no his e-book B got upset when I told him I new the author of the book , but he would have none of that threaten to get me booted from the forum because he was going to sell this book and make a lot of money

Problem was the process in the book did not work anymore ( 6 yr ) but he said he will sell this to newbies and make a fortune

Owner of the book went on WSO he made nothing , so make sure you own it before you flog it
Jason

I agree with your statements here and never looked at it that way at all but it is true. I am a victim of buying crap stuff trying to make money on the internet. Now that I am in the business and have a true mentor I realize that even though there are people who are selling shady crap that in the end the only person that is getting hurt in the long run is them because in this industry there are just too many people doing the exact same thing and eventually word does get out that their reputation is smeared. The truth always comes out and in the end they will not get the repeat customer and not build relationships so even though people like me, lost 10 bucks they wont get the next 20. Counteract that with the ethical sales builders who sell products that are of true value and you will see the true money makers and successful entrepreneurs. Justice always prevails and as long as you are honest in your dealings your conscience can always be cleaned and unharmed.

I know that in the credit card processing industry, we don't give merchant accounts for this type of thing. They're considered "get rich quick" schemes and are frowned upon big time. From a personal standpoint, I can see if someone who knows how to make money is teaching your about the right approaches, helpful tools/products, etc that's one thing. The ponzi scheme, no value added, $10 PDF is a different story.

But what is ethical in this world? Is it ethical to sell fat loss pills that kill people? Is ethical to work at a bank that take someone house? or to be a lawyer?...

Make money by telling others how to make money, ie there is no "end user" as I've read it described, nevertheless takes real skill to do. Real skills which can be much more ethically directed. We've all learned the hard way about scammers, but some dont and they just cant be helped, they have layers and layers of psychological deceit involved basically. Focus on building a real business, mmo or not. These are basic skills we all need.

I think it's alright as long as there is equal value of goods being exchanged. Most products have gems of information in them which you will be in your mind for a long long time. Besides, the whole marketing industry offline does the same thing with marketing degrees in university. I have managed to replace my day job FT income through many of the IM courses, and for that I am thankful. They teach you how to leverage your time to enable to you to spend more time with your loved ones.

Yes you are right there is a vast amount of get rich quick silver bullet type schemes which are definitely unethical and sometimes just a basic scam, which is a shame for people with genuine services and products who want to market online

Selling make money online, when you're NOT making money online is unethical.

You're not selling a make money online product, you're selling people a strategy or a skill they can implement to make money online. Every affiliate that is serious about their business buys the product they (want to) promote. If they smell it's a scam or it's just another rewritten PLR product, then they know they are not going to promote the product.

(Every affiliate that can't afford to buy the product, just ask for a review copy)

No, it's not. Not if you are actually teaching people how to benefit their business in a realistic way.

Any time I see a product with the heading "Watch EXACTLY how I make $6746/day with X marketing stream and then copy me and YOU will make exactly $6746/day doing the exact same thing as me for $7!$!$!"

I might of exaggerated but if you find a income stream where you make that kind of money day in and out then you are not going to tell people about it. Never mind sell a course that probably wouldn't even net you what you'd make in a week with the method and have every buyer saturate and ruin your income stream (or one of them).

I shake my head at those kind of products. Teach people long term skills that will make their business an actual business and not a one trick pony.

Copywriting. Email marketing. List building. SEO. Social media marketing. Anything that is essential in making a long lasting income stream the right way in online marketing.

Like.. building a email list of buyers from a product launch and engaging with them and actually helping them produce the results they are looking to make. If you help them for free when you actually promote something to them that they have to buy they will jump at the chance.

It's totally dependent of the type of affiliate company your connected with. There are companies that offered service like photos, web hosting, shopping etc. While others have food and dining, vacation places and so on.

The example you gave fits on MLM industry and I am against that practice.

But you can sell the books/tools/software that can help others to make money online.

It depends on the process followed. For example, if someone is writing a freelancing article on the effective ways to make money with kindle publishing , that isn't unethical. But if someone is faking and telling lies to lure customers in thus ripping them off , then it is indeed unethical.

I feel like you would really need to be passionate about the products that you promote. I agree with your thought though, it is definitely something to think about.

In theory, there's nothing unethical about teaching someone how to make money online.

The way it's done 99 out of 100 times? Absolutely, completely, repulsively unethical.

In fact, it gives a very bad name to those of us who try to publish quality tutorials. We have to be very careful what we call ourselves. Even "Digital Marketing Education" can give the same impression as "fake MMO guru" these days.

There have been a lot of good points made in this thread, but from looking around at all the MMO products on the three biggest affiliate networks, I have come to the conclusion that no matter what any of us may think about the niche, it's absolutely huge and getting bigger every day. It's made thousands of IMers rich, and it's not going anywhere anytime soon. Payment processors and merchant account providers can also say in public they hate it, but behind closed doors they're sitting at their conference tables with huge smiles on their faces and counting their millions that they make from it. That's just the way of the world. Like it or not, money talks.

All we can do as marketers is produce quality products, and as consumers we must do our research before purchasing. I'm not a fan of the MLM business model at all, but I know it's not going anywhere because it's making lots of people lots of money.

Over the past year or so, I've come to the same realization.

Making money online by teaching others how to make money online is sort of like a pyramid scheme.

The more experienced marketers teach the less experienced marketers how to make money online (even if the more experienced marketer isn't REALLY making money). All he/she has to do is make it SEEM like he/she is making money to sell their course.

The cycle then repeats itself as now they (the new marketers) become the new teachers in a few years' time (or less)- rehashing the same stuff.

Why is this bad?

Let's be honest: 99.99% of internet marketers are trying to make a quick buck. They DON'T care about people. To them, people are just email subscribers or traffic numbers.

So once they become successful selling garbage, they can now make a killing teaching others how to sell the same garbage.

This might be great for the marketer (at least for the short term), but it's HORRIBLE for consumers.

Just my 2 cents...

Selling offline or online underlies the same principle; getting value (product) for value (money). In IM it is very often difficult to find out that you got value for your money. You have to ask the vendor for the proof and if there is no proof then I recommend you NOT to buy. Of course you can also put in your own time and do the test. However, don't forget that you cannot buy time.

Yeah, there is a lot of red flags with money making opps. Some people claim that some of them are legit but I have never seen one survive the test of time.

Say what you will . . . It seems this is the way things are done today on the Internet.

I don't know where ethics comes into it ???

Many extra income and money making opportunities exist on the Internet where folks can earn a little or a lot of extra income by doing the very thing that seems to upset you.

Perhaps you could tell me how those interested in extra income would learn about such opportunities if there was no marketplace to offer such information.

I don't know if you have upset the apple cart with your profound question but I believe it is a curious way of looking at the way things are done . . .

90% of products which claim to be showing you how to make money are not true. There are so many lies and that's why I've never sold any money making product. Instead I'm teaching people through direct human-to-human communication. Don't ever believe for a second that you can buy an ebook and become rich. Instead you should believe in the process of learning and getting skills which will allow you to do online what you want and ultimately make lots of money!

Haha, too funny! You are so right. That's why people need to create something. Find something that you need and others will probably have a need for it too, then go out and sell it.

Guys and Gals

When you reply how about you hit the quote tab then we know who you are replying to

I agree. I spent about ten years studying various areas of internet marketing, buying a lot of products and attending a few high-priced courses, etc. I tried out a few things, but it seemed like the vast majority of what I learned either didn't pass the smell test or involved far more work- and more boring work at that- than any regular free-lance work I could get. Still, most of the marketers are extremely good at luring you into 'the dream' and it took a long while for me to really wake up and stop buying things that I didn't either a) need or b) want simply because the author of it was good at painting pretty word pictures or pulling psychological tricks like creating a sense of false scarcity or using price anchoring.

Oops! That posted before I was finished. I was going to add that nevertheless I don't think my time was wasted. Now that I've stopped chasing the 'make money in your sleep doing nothing worthwhile' dream and gotten back to my own non-generic dreams of writing fiction I find there are a number of things that are useful for marketing my work- both in terms of what to do and what not to do.

My experience is there are no real mistakes except ignoring your own desires and trying to do what all the 'experts' tell you to do. And even that is not a mistake - as long as it teaches you not to repeat it!

I agree that there are so many scams and so much rehashed BS around today when to comes to How to make money online

But what I would add is that there are always genuine opportunities around too in-between all of the nonsense others are selling.

I have personally had a great deal of success from some of my Internet Marketing ventures, however, it wasn't like this when I first started out and I made few mistakes along the way which cost me in both time and money.

even though there are people who are selling shady crap that in the end the only person that is getting hurt in the long run is them because in this industry there are just too many people doing the exact same thing and eventually word does get out that their reputation is smeared

Yes I totally get where you are coming from as I am in this "money-go-round loop" myself at the moment but there are some people in the group I am involved with making some serious 4 figure commissions right now. Cards on the table time though, I am not one of them. At present I have made a couple of small commissions but I have not fully committed myself to the training recently. I would say in the defense of the I.M. niche is that there would be no sales made if there was not a hungry willing customer base and when people type in "how do I make money on-line" there are people queuing up to take their money and show them how to do it. You pay your money and take your choice. With the right mentor and enough time and effort serious money can be made though.

Absolutely! These days I am hearing a lot about "Project Breakthrough" Jason Mclain and Vick S...they claim by 14 days training you would be able to generate a lot of income and when I checked about the price ..summing up total spent $1000 or more. What`s other take on this? Is it Legit?

Funny Cause I've even seen people out there trying to sell "How to make money online" and the people selling it have no idea how to make money themselves. Good Read! I chuckled a little cause it's true.

I honestly can't believe people spend money on that garbage. Do people seriously believe they are going to read some guide and then start making millions?

But, then again, most people are gullible and want to buy into the dream. That's why selling those "Get rich quick" scams works.

The real way to earn money is through hard work, truly learning from failures, and never giving up.