Profanity in Emails?

Banned 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Jason H

What do you guys think about using profanity in emails, typically in email subject line?

I personally think it has a place depending on your audience, and can probably increase open rate; however, it does speak a lot about the sender, like if is actually somebody you can trust and want to do business with, especially if you were using it for the IM niche.

Dunno about subject lines but some guy called Frank Kern just sent me an email about Kajabi with this in the first line - I want to warn you in advance that I fully plan to promote the bejeezus out of this:

But if you've been to an FK event you'll notice he loves to use colorful language.

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14 years ago

How does use of profanity relate to trust, in any way? They are just words and only have meaning that you, personally, attach to them. If you are offended by a word, it's because you chose to be offended. It says nothing about the sender. Most people use profanity, but will refrain from using when dealing with people they don't know. Some marketers choose to just be themselves, and speak like they do around their friends. How does that make them less trustworthy?

Bottom line, if it bothers you, unsubscribe from their list.

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Banned 14 years ago

Originally Posted by RanD

If you are offended by a word, it's because you chose to be offended. It says nothing about the sender.

In this context, it says about the sender that he was willing knowingly to risk offending some people on his list. That's not "nothing".

Originally Posted by RanD

Bottom line, if it bothers you, unsubscribe from their list.

It doesn't bother me, but I still think they're usually making a mistake using it.
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- Shaun OReilly
  
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  14 years ago
  
  I remember hearing Jim Rohn talk about the use of profanity
  and he said that...
  
  If you use profanity, you're guaranteed to offend some of
  your audience (because of the profanity).
  
  If you don't use profanity at all, you're guaranteed NOT to offend
  anyone (by your non-use of profanity).
  
  So, in a business situation, he recommended not using profanity
  at all.
  
  That was from a seminar in the 80s though.
  
  Nowadays, I think that some people are less offended by a mild
  use of profanity - but many will still be offended.
  
  However, placing profanity in a subject line is not appropriate
  in my opinion. It's just using profanity to shock when there
  are other equally efficient ways of getting attention and making
  sure that the e-mail gets read.
  
  I grew up with a Glaswegian father so the use of profanity in
  virtually every second sentence was a common occurance.
  
  I also lived in Ireland for a while and I can assure you they
  don't hold back on using profanity in everyday conversation
  (except in church).
  
  That said, profanity should not be a default part of regular
  business communication. There are times when the occassional
  swear word is OK - to emphasize a point for example - but as
  a general rule don't slip into profanity when there are millions
  of other words to choose from.
  
  Dedicated to your success,
  
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  jlxsolutions
  
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  14 years ago
  
  example given:This is F**ing amazing or similar
  To be honest dont you use that kind of words in RL (reallife)
  to me it brings trust its a human behind.
  Not a marketing moron whos only goal in life is to pet you to sell his crappy BS.
  Thou i speak for my self only i want brutal honesty and brutal words if they suit the subject.
  And recently i have done the same i actually learned it by teaching someone else to do it and i realised i was not as point blank as i tought.
  My eyes are open i just wish the reats of the worlds billions would open theirs.
  expect no modifying of my words except for some *** for public rules
  Brutal honesty is the future.
  This reminds me of one of my first bosses.
  He was an azz always blaiming his faults or mistakes on employees
  never blamed me for anything oddly.
  But i remember the last week i was there he went of like a fireracker at one of the female employees for something i knew myself he had messed up thou i am sure he had forgotten himself.
  i grabbed him threw him into the wall and said to him to calm down dragged him into his office and showed him his own notes. in the end i was the only employee he ever showed respect to even his behaviour changed alot after.
  Honesty is the key to true freedom and succes. whit out brutal honesty one is just a shell conforming to the society. the ONE sand corn inside the shell makes the pearl in a clam not the trillions out side.
  End of mad mans rant i hope i made some sense at all
  Jan.Lukkarinen
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- RanD
  
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  14 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by Alexa Smith
  
  In this context, it says about the sender that he was willing knowingly to risk offending some people on his list. That's not "nothing".
  
  It is "nothing". What does it say about him, that he willingly risked offending people on his list, other than he chose not to let others dictate who he is? It certainly says nothing about how trustworthy he is, which is what was called into question in the OP. Nothing offends me, unless someone is intentionally trying to offend me, which I'm assuming was not the case here. Some people are far too sensitive about words, especially the ones that have the exact same meaning as other words that people find perfectly acceptable. It's funny that people will find the comment "kiss my butt" funny in a prime time sitcom, but "Kiss my a$$" offensive. Exact same meaning. As I said, if you are offended by a word, you chose to be offended. He didn't offend you.
  
  Was it a good marketing move? I don't know. I don't know him. Some marketers talk like that right from the start and their list know what to expect. If you can't tolerate it, unsubscribe. Problem solved.
  
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14 years ago

Does not increase my open rate, send me one with direct profanity in the subject and it will result in one of two events. I either report it as spam, or I unsubscribe from the list, or if you are really lucky, I'll do both.

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14 years ago

Originally Posted by Barry Unruh

Does not increase my open rate, send me one with direct profanity in the subject and it will result in one of two events. I either report it as spam, or I unsubscribe from the list, or if you are really lucky, I'll do both.

Most of the receivers will react the same way. But then it depends upon many other factors as well.

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14 years ago

Originally Posted by Barry Unruh

Does not increase my open rate, send me one with direct profanity in the subject and it will result in one of two events. I either report it as spam, or I unsubscribe from the list, or if you are really lucky, I'll do both.

I couldn't agree with you more

People in cyberspace have to remember that although they are sitting alone at their computer, they are not alone on the global network. There's basic online etiquette to be taken into account. Offending someone online will only bring bad publicity to your business. After all the whole purpose of an email list is to promote your website and business. So why chase potential clients away by offending them with bad language?!

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14 years ago

Originally Posted by Barry Unruh

Does not increase my open rate, send me one with direct profanity in the subject and it will result in one of two events. I either report it as spam, or I unsubscribe from the list, or if you are really lucky, I'll do both.

If you are offended by something - whether it be profanity or anything else - then of course you have the option of unsubscribing.

But under what circumstances could anything in the subject line - again profanity or anything else - make an e-mail spam?

You asked for it? Not spam. You didn't sign up or otherwise subscribe? Spam.

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14 years ago

Are you talking about using four letter words or just colourful language?

If I got emails with swear words in the subject line I would certainly unsubscribe from that list.

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14 years ago

I don't know about you guys, but using it tastefully (if you want to put it like that) has improved my open rates in some niches.

Just don't over do it, or do it for the sake of doing it.

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14 years ago

Originally Posted by Dean Jackson

I don't know about you guys, but using it tastefully (if you want to put it like that) has improved my open rates in some niches.

Just don't over do it, or do it for the sake of doing it.

How can you use profanity "tastefully?" That just doesn't make any sense at all! Have you tested this and found that it really works? Or could it maybe possibly just be how you are marketing things instead?

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14 years ago

Originally Posted by scrofford

How can you use profanity "tastefully?" That just doesn't make any sense at all! Have you tested this and found that it really works? Or could it maybe possibly just be how you are marketing things instead?

Some people agree with it, some people don't.

I think we can all conclude that it comes down to who you're marketing to, your personality/relationship with your list or customers, and HOW you choose to use them.

I will NOT drop an outright "F bomb" in my marketing EVER. Maybe I'll use it in an abbreviation of some sort

, but never outright.

I use words like BS, Sh*tload, and a few others on the same level if you're familiar with my work.

The CopyNazi would be proud

If you have marketed 100% clean and out of the blue you start using profanity, it might come as a bit of a shock to your readers.

If they signed up and they know what you're like, they'll expect it, and you won't have any problems.

And yes I have tested this, and improved conversion rates. Especially in the PUA niche.

And I'm blown away by the ignorance of some of these posts. Just because you swear, either online or offline doesn't "prove" that your a lower class individual.

I like people who swear every now and then. Heck even Maria Gudelis does it every now and then and it's pretty funny IMO. I'd go as far as saying that it SHOWS personality.

- Dean

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14 years ago

Thank you for starting this thread :-) I consider this an important issue. Personally I'm absolutely against the use of bad language, especially the use of profanities. I put on all my forum guidelines a clause stating that no bad language is permitted. In my mind the use of profanities in a public forum is the same as walking down the road naked. The general public doesn't have to be exposed to things which are considered in many cultures as immoral. The use of profanities is not acceptable for devout Muslims, Christians and Jews. There are many more cultures which consider the use of profanities an offense.

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14 years ago

Personally I don't give a rats ass how another person chooses to conduct themselves.

Chris

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14 years ago

Honest to goodness.. It will get a higher open rate too..

And a nice ctr...

Caleb.

...

Oh yeah... And the open rate will be people clicking on the "Unsubscribe" link and then clicking the report e-mail as spam link.

Swearing in your e-mails is what gets people not to open them. You realize that it offends a lot of people, and that those people who you offend will NEVER be your buyers again, and will probably tell there friends about it as well.

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14 years ago

Originally Posted by Caleb Spilchen

Honest to goodness.. It will get a higher open rate too..

And a nice ctr...

Caleb.

...

Oh yeah... And the open rate will be people clicking on the "Unsubscribe" link and then clicking the report e-mail as spam link.

Swearing in your e-mails is what gets people not to open them. You realize that it offends a lot of people, and that those people who you offend will NEVER be your buyers again, and will probably tell there friends about it as well.

'
If you target purrty purtys yes.
IF you target a "normal" working man Well they be proud you eb a honest god damm mothaf**'' amen but people are diffrent and i think about (Guess from own calcs) only 45% are purty purty.
Edit: in the IM targeting

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14 years ago

Originally Posted by Caleb Spilchen

Swearing in your e-mails is what gets people not to open them. You realize that it offends a lot of people, and that those people who you offend will NEVER be your buyers again, and will probably tell there friends about it as well.

To be honest, if someone "tells their friends" not to buy from someone because they swore in an email, they are hardly the kind of customer you want. I'd suspect these are the same people who are serial refunders, too.

I personally don't do it, but I certainly wouldn't be offended if someone did. Everyone has their own personality.

My only pet hate is spelling mistakes, that says more to me about a person than their choice of words.

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14 years ago

Originally Posted by Thomas Smale

To be honest, if someone "tells their friends" not to buy from someone because they swore in an email, they are hardly the kind of customer you want. I'd suspect these are the same people who are serial refunders, too.

I personally don't do it, but I certainly wouldn't be offended if someone did. Everyone has their own personality.

My only pet hate is spelling mistakes, that says more to me about a person than their choice of words.

Concerning spelling mistakes vs. profanities:
Many successful business people are dyslectic and find ways to overcome this. I wouldn't disqualify a person for Dyslexia because it doesn't mean anything about their honesty or the quality of their service. However rude language says a lot about a person's character. A vendor or service provider, who is sensitive to other people's feelings, will also be more sensitive to customer satisfaction. A rude email will not only find its way into my spam folder but the sender will be placed on the list of people I'd rather not deal with. People with a dirty mouth (or keyboard) are personally distasteful to me. Shopping (on- or off-line) is something I want to enjoy and for that I need a vendor who makes me feel comfortable.

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14 years ago

It says nothing about the sender.

I totally disagree - everything you write in your emails to your list says something about you.

Profanity is used with the excuse of "being real" or "standing out" - but in truth the words to use are limited and are not unique.

Your list will be better if your emails to them are about "them" and not about your right to express yourself in any way you choose. Profanity in an email subject line is an unsubscribe for me.

I'm not offended - but not interested in someone who thinks street talk is acceptable in business. You may cuss like a sailor at home - but probably don't do that if you work an office job. Why would it be acceptable when you are running your own business? I wouldn't shop offline at a store where the salesperson was f-this and f-that - why would I do it online?

It's a choice you make for yourself and, honestly, no one cares. People can stay or unsubscribe. It's not their loss as there are many other lists to join.

What you send to your list determines the quality of your list. It's a good thing to keep in mind.

kay
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14 years ago

Originally Posted by Thomas Smale

To be honest, if someone "tells their friends" not to buy from someone because they swore in an email, they are hardly the kind of customer you want. I'd suspect these are the same people who are serial refunders, too.

I personally don't do it, but I certainly wouldn't be offended if someone did. Everyone has their own personality.

My only pet hate is spelling mistakes, that says more to me about a person than their choice of words.

Thomas,

I don't admit to not swearing.. Fact is, I'm a teen...

Anyways, I think that if you're going to go around and actually drop the F-Bomb in your title, not be like I kicked someones a$$ which is fine... then it's wrong.

When I say they go around telling there friends, I'm saying if someone outright drops one..

C

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14 years ago

Originally Posted by Caleb Spilchen

Thomas,

I don't admit to not swearing.. Fact is, I'm a teen...

Anyways, I think that if you're going to go around and actually drop the F-Bomb in your title, not be like I kicked someones a$$ which is fine... then it's wrong.

When I say they go around telling there friends, I'm saying if someone outright drops one..

C

Hi Caleb,

You raise another point, and that is which words are offensive.

The answer is different for everybody.

The words I think are unacceptable in a business context are many. Even words some would consider mild, such as your example of a** above. Others I won't use are d***, p***** off, h***, s***, b****ing, and so on.

BUT...

That's just me.

While it would be great if people didn't use such words in that context, it IS important to be yourself, too. However, if that self rubs people the wrong way, then that's the risk they have to take.

At the same time, if somebody is swearing because it "helps me connect with my audience", then I see that as a phony attempt to sound more "real". The other term for that is being phony, and obviously not a good thing.

All the best,
Michael

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14 years ago

trying to get the easily offended to unsubscribe?? Ever think of that?

Never thought of that - is the point of your list to have only people who can't be offended? Or to appeal to those interested in buying your products?

Why not put the same profanity on the squeeze page or sign-up form and stop those nasty clean-speakers from signing up at all?:p

kay

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14 years ago

Originally Posted by Kay King

Never thought of that - is the point of your list to have only people who can't be offended? Or to appeal to those interested in buying your products?

Why not put the same profanity on the squeeze page or sign-up form and stop those nasty clean-speakers from signing up at all?:p

kay

haha... Hey I've used profanity on sales pages before... 8)

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14 years ago

If you're my bud and we're sitting at a f**king bar, drinking beer and talking about the good ole days, then I'd consider it totally appropriate. If you're a IM "guru" trying to chummy up with me and make me feel like we're pals because I was foolish enough to subscribe to your list and purchase your $37 WSO, then consider me unsubscribed from your f***ing list. But that's just me. :p
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14 years ago

I don't swear in emails or subscribe to marketers who do so. Then again, I don't swear in "real life" either, nor do I spend much time around most who swear endlessly, so I'm consistent.

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14 years ago

Originally Posted by Zabrina

I don't swear in emails or subscribe to marketers who do so. Then again, I don't swear in "real life" either, nor do I spend much time around most who swear endlessly, so I'm consistent.

This is a very good point you made, Zabrina

It supports the notion that a person's choice of words online very much reflects that person's general behavior offline. The golden rule is: Birds of a feather flock together - both in business and in pleasure. Someone who chooses to use only clean language in their real life will also prefer the company of people who do so as well. The same is true in cyberspace, someone who takes care to word their messages in respectable language will choose only to interact with others who do as well.

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14 years ago

Originally Posted by ListBuildingForNewbies

This is a very good point you made, Zabrina

It supports the notion that a person's choice of words online very much reflects that person's general behavior offline. The golden rule is: Birds of a feather flock together - both in business and in pleasure. Someone who chooses to use only clean language in their real life will also prefer the company of people who do so as well. The same is true in cyberspace, someone who takes care to word their messages in respectable language will choose only to interact with others who do as well.

That simply isn't true. While there may be a tendency to do so, such a blanket statement is simply false. I have a failry large group of online friends (all marketers), and some of us don't swear, some swear once in a while, and others freely pepper their language with select words.

However, I consider ALL of them my friends. While I choose not to swear, I don't hold it against somebody else if they do. At least not in that context.

That being said, when we team up on anything, I always like to review over any messages that get sent out, to keep the swearing in check.

What it comes down to is respect. If I feel the swearing is being done disrespectfully, then I will unsubscribe. But that also holds tru for those who don't swear in their e-mails. In fact, I can think of a few hypothetical situations where I would stay subscribed to someone who swears, but unsubscribe from somebody who doesn't.

Do I agree with swearing? Nope.

Do I get worked up about it? Not usually.

Is anything we say here going to get people to stop swearing so much. Nope. But...I agree with Jim Rohn's position on it, and wish others would at least try to see the logic behind it.

All the best,
Michael

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14 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Oksa

However, I consider ALL of them my friends. While I choose not to swear, I don't hold it against somebody else if they do. At least not in that context.

That being said, when we team up on anything, I always like to review over any messages that get sent out, to keep the swearing in check.

What it comes down to is respect. If I feel the swearing is being done disrespectfully, then I will unsubscribe. But that also holds tru for those who don't swear in their e-mails. In fact, I can think of a few hypothetical situations where I would stay subscribed to someone who swears, but unsubscribe from somebody who doesn't.

Do I agree with swearing? Nope.

Do I get worked up about it? Not usually.

Is anything we say here going to get people to stop swearing so much. Nope. But...I agree with Jim Rohn's position on it, and wish others would at least try to see the logic behind it.

All the best,
Michael

Hi Michael

First of all you stated that you are prepared to forgive people WHO YOU ALREADY KNOW for their fowl language. A marketing email is sent by someone the recipient doesn't know. It's like someone who'll avoid eating in a restaurant which isn't clean and tidy, but will be prepared to have a meal at his friend's house even if the house is dirty and messy.
Secondly, you admitted that you will consciously avoid using bad language in your business correspondence and make sure your employees do as well. This in itself proves my point.
Thirdly, group pressure can do a lot to change standards of behavior. Therefore I have no doubt that this thread will also have an effect, even if it's only on a very small scale.

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14 years ago

Originally Posted by ListBuildingForNewbies

This is a very good point you made, Zabrina

It supports the notion that a person's choice of words online very much reflects that person's general behavior offline. The golden rule is: Birds of a feather flock together - both in business and in pleasure. Someone who chooses to use only clean language in their real life will also prefer the company of people who do so as well. The same is true in cyberspace, someone who takes care to word their messages in respectable language will choose only to interact with others who do as well.

I think that, to some extent, this is true. It tends to be one unconscious factor in selecting my friends, as I've noticed that hearing someone I don't know endlessly swearing is an immediate turn-off and makes me think certain things about them.

Originally Posted by Michael Oksa

That simply isn't true. While there may be a tendency to do so, such a blanket statement is simply false. I have a failry large group of online friends (all marketers), and some of us don't swear, some swear once in a while, and others freely pepper their language with select words.

However, I consider ALL of them my friends. While I choose not to swear, I don't hold it against somebody else if they do. At least not in that context.

That being said, when we team up on anything, I always like to review over any messages that get sent out, to keep the swearing in check.

What it comes down to is respect. If I feel the swearing is being done disrespectfully, then I will unsubscribe. But that also holds tru for those who don't swear in their e-mails. In fact, I can think of a few hypothetical situations where I would stay subscribed to someone who swears, but unsubscribe from somebody who doesn't.

Do I agree with swearing? Nope.

Do I get worked up about it? Not usually.

Is anything we say here going to get people to stop swearing so much. Nope. But...I agree with Jim Rohn's position on it, and wish others would at least try to see the logic behind it.

All the best,
Michael

I have friends in real life who swear, but I still don't have to like it or put up with it. Because I value their friendships, I put up with it. They do so respectfully and never at me or in ways I deem offensive -- that's why they're my friends.

I don't personally know most internet marketers whose lists I'm on. Therefore, I don't have a good reason to put up with it, and because most communication is through text, I'm going to think differently of them like I would with someone from real life who swore too much.

The thing is, my friends in "real life" get chances to override the impressions of them that they convey based on their language through their body language, nonverbal communication, etc. People online can't overcome that language barrier.

Just some thoughts -- I like a good debate.

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14 years ago

Originally Posted by ListBuildingForNewbies

Hi Michael

First of all you stated that you are prepared to forgive people WHO YOU ALREADY KNOW for their fowl language. A marketing email is sent by someone the recipient doesn't know. It's like someone who'll avoid eating in a restaurant which isn't clean and tidy, but will be prepared to have a meal at his friend's house even if the house is dirty and messy.
Secondly, you admitted that you will consciously avoid using bad language in your business correspondence and make sure your employees do as well. This in itself proves my point.
Thirdly, group pressure can do a lot to change standards of behavior. Therefore I have no doubt that this thread will also have an effect, even if it's only on a very small scale.

I didn't say "forgive", I said I don't hold it against them - BIG difference.

Also, I was referring to JV partners, not employees or freelancers. Of course, the rule would still be the same, though a JV partner has an equal say, so it would be possible for some swearing to make its way through.

You said "someone who takes care to word their messages in respectable language will choose only to interact with others who do as well". That's not true. My point was that we choose to interact with all types of people.

You're right about group pressure, but keep in mind that it works both ways. Some people will read this thread and come away with the idea that it IS okay to swear. Net effect? Most likely zero.

While I think swearing is not acceptable in a business setting, YES, EVEN WHEN FRANK KERN DOES IT, I prefer a pragmatic approach. I understand it happens, which brings me back to my earlier point:

If you're going to send out an e-mail with swearing in it, then feel free to have a swear word in the subject line. That way your readers won't be under any false pretenses about what may be inside.

All the best,
Michael

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14 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Oksa

If you're going to send out an e-mail with swearing in it, then feel free to have a swear word in the subject line. That way your readers won't be under any false pretenses about what may be inside.

Well, my point is that the general discourse culture in business should adhere to certain standards of behavior, not only off-line but on-line as well. Personally I consider it psychological harassment to find in my inbox an email with a dirty word in the subject line. Profane language is offensive to me personally, and trillions of other humans worldwide, in any place on my computer screen - whether in the subject line in the mail itself or even in the email address.

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14 years ago

Originally Posted by ListBuildingForNewbies

Well, my point is that the general discourse culture in business should adhere to certain standards of behavior, not only off-line but on-line as well. Personally I consider it psychological harassment to find in my inbox an email with a dirty word in the subject line. Profane language is offensive to me personally, and trillions of other humans worldwide, in any place on my computer screen - whether in the subject line in the mail itself or even in the email address.

I agree with you for the most part. I would say that there ARE standards, not that there "should be". Those who swear are outside of those standards, and are taking a risk by swearing.

I wouldn't go so far as to say it is psychological harassment. That sounds WAY too much like victim mentality. The only way to completely avoid it would be to close yourself off from the rest of society, and that wouldn't be very practical.

I also disagree with your assertion that there are trillions of people on the planet. Last I checked, it was just over 7 billion. That means you're off by at least 1,993,000,000,000 people. (Sorry, couldn't resist

)

All the best,
Michael

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14 years ago

One of my best selling emails was something I wrote a couple of years ago for Andy Jenkins promoting one of my client's affiliate products. The subject line?

"I just kicked Tiger Wood's @#$..."

But I don't think it was the veiled profanity that sold it. It was the idea, the theme, and the intrigue of the subject line that made this one work. And since it was coming from Andy's lips (and he has a strong, assertive personality), I could have a little fun with it. Hence the added "@#$".

With that said, I try to avoid profanity in my emails if at all possible. It worked for this one, but it usually just clutters up the text and ticks some people off.

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14 years ago

Maybe they are trying to get the easily offended to unsubscribe?? Ever think of that? hehe
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  14 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by zerofill
  
  Maybe they are trying to get the easily offended to unsubscribe?? Ever think of that? hehe
  
  That's a $#&*!)' pile of #^**%, and you %^&!)+** know it!
  
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  14 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by Michael Oksa
  
  That's a $#&*!)' pile of #^**%, and you %^&!)+** know it!
  
  ~M~
  
  Oh yeah? Well %@ck this! I'm #@%$ing out of here!
  
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14 years ago

Originally Posted by Jay White

One of my best selling emails was something I wrote a couple of years ago for Andy Jenkins promoting one of my client's affiliate products. The subject line?

"I just kicked Tiger Wood's @#$..."

But I don't think it was the veiled profanity that sold it. It was the idea, the theme, and the intrigue of the subject line that made this one work. And since it was coming from Andy's lips (and he has a strong, assertive personality), I could have a little fun with it. Hence the added "@#$".

With that said, I try to avoid profanity in my emails if at all possible. It worked for this one, but it usually just clutters up the text and ticks some people off.

Expressions like "I just kicked Tiger Wood's @#$..." are within the boundaries of being tolerable but far from being respectable. Indeed the character combination @#$ says nothing explicit and leaves everything open to the imagination ... like "I just kicked Tiger Wood's cat" or "I just kicked Tiger Wood's car". Nonetheless the use of these icons (@#$) indicates that they stand for something dirty. And therefore placing such a sentence in an email is considered to be vulgar language and gives the impression of being cheap, low-class, uneducated and 2nd rate.

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14 years ago

Apart from whether or not swearing is right or wrong, I actually LIKE the idea of using it IN the subject line--assuming it's going to be used anyway.

Why?

That way easily offended readers won't open it. They can just delete it without further offending their sensibilities. No surprises about what could be inside.

I would much rather have a head's up on it, rather than seeing an innocuous subject line, only to be barraged by a slew of profanities.

All the best,
Michael

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14 years ago

I agree with Kay. It's surprising what people think they can get away with online, that they wouldn't do offline. Maybe the anonymity or they don't have to see the expression on your face when they say it.

Either way, to me it shows a lack of command for the English language and the profanity becomes filler for the lack of being able to come up with something intelligent to say.

Thanks,

John

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14 years ago

I swear in my on stage talks but rarely in text. When you speak and swearing happens it's from passion. In text it's too easily calculated.

I like it when speakers swear. I have no opinion on email but I rarely swear in mine.

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14 years ago

Why would you want to eliminate anyone by offending when there are thousands of other words you could use?

Unless you are targeting a VERY specific market that will feel more connected to you because you cuss - I would say it's not worth it.

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14 years ago

I think that profanity works for some but fails for others.. Like Frank Kern it works but for someone else it may not. And some people have enough subscribers that it doesn't bother them to offend some. Definitely, gets the attention of others!

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14 years ago

I don't care if they say a** or da**, but if you pull an f bomb in an e-mail title well that's bad taste...

I get what your saying Michael, what words are acceptable? I would rather stay away from it all together, in worrry of it... Of course, an F bomb drops in the occasional business conversation.... I remember this guy calling me about a JV once, and dropping f bombs (ironically, I never did a jv with the guy.. unrelated reason).

If they say "D**** straight" or something.. All is cool, but if it's like "What the f****", then its weird.

Caleb

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14 years ago

Originally Posted by Caleb Spilchen

I don't care if they say a** or da**, but if you pull an f bomb in an e-mail title well that's bad taste...

Caleb

only in your opinion Caleb see my post above
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14 years ago

Some of y'all will remember the fuss over Lenny Bruce and his use of profanity in his comedy act. There were places that simply refused to book him because of it. Nowadays, ol' Lenny would be fairly mild.

There's a whole new breed that, if you took the profanity out of their vocabulary, their 60 minute sets would be 8 minutes long. The crazy thing is, put them on Leno's show or someplace else where the censors and the FCC would nail them and they prove they can be funny without the F-bomb.

I'll cop to occasionally dropping a cuss word into a spontaneous message like a forum posting. I don't make a practice out of it because it would be out of character for me.

If you are peppering your message with 'the seven words you can't say on TV' for effect, keep in mind that the more you do it, the more inured to it your audience becomes. (BTW, I think the list is down to three or four now.)

Besides, there are things people put in emails that I consider much more offensive than a few four letter words. During the last American election cycle, I dumped a list I'd been on for months because the list owners chose to broadcast political rants. Others will stray into religion, a big no-no for me. Even gentle Jesus drove the moneychangers from the temple.

Some people use cussing as a way to 'talk to the common man', and it's pretty obvious that they're doing it for the effect. The words themselves don't offend me. The implied disrespect does. If you think I'm so ignorant that you have to lower yourself to communicate with me, I don't need to communicate with you. Besides, have you ever noticed how silly a little kid sounds when he/she finds out they can get a rise out of Mummy and Daddy by cussing?

Do you want to sound like an attention-craving toddler?
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14 years ago

Its a perfectly reasonable marketing strategy to allienate and divide your listners

look at howard stern. the people who hate him still listen to his show if only so they can bitch about him

Everything else in this thread is just an opinion and every one has one.

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14 years ago

Would you use profanity in the middle of a business meeting? Then, why would you use it as part of your marketing campaign? Sure, you might be working from home in your PJ's, but this is still your business.

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14 years ago

I've never used/tested profanity in e-mails and have no intention of doing so

However I do think this depends on the market, if someone is in the adult market for example the audience may even expect it.

Or shock comedians, if they have an e-mail list of fans/followers they may well be expecting it.

But if you're in a market involving cooking recipes with a general demographic of ladies over 50, using profanity probably isn't the smartest idea

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14 years ago

really depends on the audience , But there are some instances where it fits. I try to use words in them cases, that are "like a curse" but grandmothers version of it lol

for example, the link in my signature. " SEO BullCrap"

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14 years ago

Love it...

Talk dirty to me all you like :p

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14 years ago

Originally Posted by Glenn Grundberg

Love it...

Talk dirty to me all you like :p

lol note to self, start writing dirty sales letters lol
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14 years ago

Originally Posted by Jason H

What do you guys think about using profanity in emails, typically in email subject line?

I personally think it has a place depending on your audience, and can probably increase open rate; however, it does speak a lot about the sender, like if is actually somebody you can trust and want to do business with, especially if you were using it for the IM niche.

I don't think it's necessary. Some people appreciate shock value, but if a person needs to resort to shock value to get my attention he probably isn't as good at what he does as he thinks he is.

I once read a thread linking to an article that used profanity in the subject/title. Many of the readers were offended by the article itself but the part that interested me most was the number of people who believed the person sharing the link posted the article. Double negative.

True, we choose how to react to the things we see - but as a marketer you need to be conscious enough to know how the vast majority might react. There's no excuse for offending your audience.

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14 years ago

Originally Posted by DeborahDera

I don't think it's necessary. Some people appreciate shock value, but if a person needs to resort to shock value to get my attention he probably isn't as good at what he does as he thinks he is.

Actually, Howard Stern does a pretty good job at shocking people, consequently, he is the highest paid radio personality anywhere in the world, in fact, i hazard a bet he is the highest paid individual in the world at $100 million a year.

Chris

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14 years ago

I don't get offended for bad words at all and I don't hesitate to use them when needed, because the goal of the email is to create a relationship with your prospects, you don't need to be too "corporate" you want to be natural, to be their friend and show yourself, so they trust you and with the time buy you, furthermore I don't see anything bad with the use of bad words.

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14 years ago

Originally Posted by patadeperro

I don't get offended for bad words at all and I don't hesitate to use them when needed, because the goal of the email is to create a relationship with your prospects, you don't need to be too "corporate" you want to be natural, to be their friend and show yourself, so they trust you and with the time buy you, furthermore I don't see anything bad with the use of bad words.

That's all well and good, but...

As soon as you start thinking "Hey! I'll swear here to sound more natural", it is no longer natural. Then it's manipulative.

~Michael

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14 years ago

It can be an effective tool for others but I won't do it. There's a right time to use profanity and for me it's not in sending out emails in getting people to work with you as partners. And yes, having it on the subject line may cause people to unsubscribe and lose your revenue in the process.

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14 years ago

Originally Posted by misterhu

There’s a right time to use profanity

With all due respect, I totally disagree with this. NEVER is there a right time for using profanities. Using profanities is like any other anti-social behavior: letting your dog mess up public parks, throwing your garbage into the street instead of a garbage container, playing loud disco music in your neighborhood at 2:00 a.m. Just as there's no room for such behavior ANYTIME and ANYWHERE, there is no time and place where the use of dirty language is acceptable.
Verbal hygiene is the basic building block in the foundations of a civilized society … and I'll continue to use my keyboard to fight for making cyberspace more civilized. Since the 1990s we've come a long way but there's still a long way to go until our standards of public discourse will be the way they should be.
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