School Rejected Offer From Successful Entrepreneur

13 years ago

Originally Posted by thunderbird

A friend of mine who has started and sold a lot of successful businesses from scratch offered to give a single workshop in his 10-year-old son's class on how to start a business. They rejected his offer. Why? They said they're training students to be employees, not employers.

Now THAT is STUPID!!!!!!! I heard a story of two brothers once. I WISH I could remember the names, etc... But it is a REAL story! They were relatively poor. One brother was smart, did well in school, etc... His father put him through the best college, etc... The other one had some problems. His father said he couldn't stand college, and HE was sent off to trade school. His father said he would do better in trade school.

So WHAT happened? The college educated brother ended up in a moderately high position in a reasonably successful company, as I recall.

YEAH, YEAH, but WHAT happened to the one whose father said he couldn't do college, etc??????

OK, he stopped working with his hands really. He didn't really see the point too much. In the documentary I watched, he was in a skyway merely watching the others work. the guy next to the brother said his father was RIGHT! It came off as an INSULT! The brother kind of smiled and nodded his head in agreement.

You see, he was the head of a moderately large company that was a market leader.

If you kill creativity and knowledge, it is the EPITOME of trying to steal a persons value and enslave them. In the long run it will likely hurt society as a whole.

MAN, I have a MILLION of them! Like the story of a person that supposedly saved another and the saved persons son ended up saving HIS son. Supposedly, that story was not true but, true or not, it shows how fate can change things. What of the guy that helped fund research of the MRI and supposedly ended up getting saved by the very MRI he helped fund?

Steve

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tagiscom

13 years ago

A friend of mine who has started and sold a lot of successful businesses from scratch offered to give a single workshop in his 10-year-old son's class on how to start a business. The school rejected his offer. Why? They said they're training students to be employees, not employers.

Not, a bit surprised by that, the education system is set up to churn out workers and soldiers!

And people who don't fit into this model, usually go on to change the world for the better!

Shane

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whateverpedia 13 years ago

Originally Posted by tagiscom

Not, a bit surprised by that, the education system is set up to churn out workers and soldiers!

That's in the public system. In the private system they churn out executives and generals.

Neither system is geared towards producing anything other than cogs in the machine(s).

Despite the fact that back in my day free thinking was encouraged, it was still geared towards fitting you into an existing "machine", rather than the being the creator of a new machine(s).

It has always been that way, and sadly it always will.
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yukon

Banned 13 years ago

Originally Posted by thunderbird

... The school rejected his offer. Why? They said they're training students to be employees, not employers.

That's just sad.

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Kay King

13 years ago

They said they're training students to be employees, not employers.

Is that really what they said - or his interpretation of what was said?

That said, I think 10 is too young to hold a workshop on building a business. I'm sure he means well but I think that kind of workshop would be best in high school as a series of workshops that balances jobs and careers and business ownership. The goal of a balanced series would be to educate kids so they can make their own career choices from a position of knowledge of what's involved. I think high school administrators would be more receptive.

We seem to be urging young kids to think about ways to "make money" - but first they need to learn how to manage money and that is a subject too often ignored.

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thunderbird

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Kay King

Is that really what they said - or his interpretation of what was said?

That said, I think 10 is too young to hold a workshop on building a business. I'm sure he means well but I think that kind of workshop would be best in high school as a series of workshops that balances jobs and careers and business ownership. The goal of a balanced series would be to educate kids so they can make their own career choices from a position of knowledge of what's involved. I think high school administrators would be more receptive.

We seem to be urging young kids to think about ways to "make money" - but first they need to learn how to manage money and that is a subject too often ignored.

Yes, that is what they said, word for word, not interpretation. 10 is certainly not too young. 10-year-olds are very smart and understand advanced concepts. It is an ideal time to first introduce such concepts to kids in a simple workshop. Another reason not to second-guess my friend is that his 10-year-old successfully set-up a business with almost no help from his father, and makes more money than most adult employees, and is well-positioned to pursue whatever career choices he makes in coming years.

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yukon

Banned 13 years ago

I don't think it's a bad idea at 10 years old, it teaches responsibility, creative thinking, leadership, communication skills, etc...

I'm not suggesting the kids be tycoons be age 18, just saying that showing kids they don't have to have a cookie cutter career isn't a bad thing.

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Kay King

13 years ago

just saying that showing kids they don't have to have a cookie cutter career isn't a bad thing.

That's exactly the attitude that would concern me - there's nothing wrong with professional careers and nothing wrong with working a job, either.

If his son is so successful - that might be a reason for school to refuse the offer. They might worry his goal is to encourage other 10 yr olds to start a business - and many parents would not appreciate that or be willing to support it.

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yukon

Banned 13 years ago

Originally Posted by Kay King

That's exactly the attitude that would concern me - there's nothing wrong with professional careers and nothing wrong with working a job, either.

If his son is so successful - that might be a reason for school to refuse the offer. They might worry his goal is to encourage other 10 yr olds to start a business - and many parents would not appreciate that or be willing to support it.

I don't know about anyone else but my public elementary/high schools had career days. In elementary school kids brought their parents to school & the parent would explain what their career was to the entire class.

I guess times have changed.

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Dan Riffle

13 years ago

Originally Posted by yukon

I don't know about anyone else but my public elementary/high schools had career days. In elementary school kids brought their parents to school & the parent would explain what their career was to the entire class.

I guess times have changed.

I don't recall them in elementary school or middle school, but there were a few in high school. We also had general business classes you could take as an elective.

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seasoned

13 years ago

A child that is 10 years old is supposed to have a head that is about 90% of the size of an adult. The PC world talks a lot about equality, but figures that kids are really not capable of doing much. The fact is that a good deal of attitude, etc... happens before 6, and much of the rest happens before 11. And kids have more time, and more energy.

The idea that a school would ADMIT OPENLY, WORD FOR WORD, that they are there to basically PROGRAM kids speaks VOLUMES! That is ONE set of books I would LOVE to burn!

And I watched a program and they said that closing some schools would be a BAD idea and hurt families. WHY? Well, they TRIED double speak, etc... but eventually they said the TRUTH. They wanted free "childcare". So we pay people a lot, on the pretense that they are teaching, but really just want "CHILDCARE"? GIVE ME A BREAK!

Frankly, if I had kids, I would give them the information and help that I never got. I have known a number of geniuses. Some were officially so, and some were ones that clearly seemed to be. MOST were like a kid that I know that went to a highschool I did. At the time, I was really interested in computers and luckily THIS school was part of a computer program. At the time, that was RARE! I was actually in the next room. My computer teacher was the head of the math department, the math club, etc... Anyway, I was in the computer room well the friend I am speaking about was in the math club next door. He astounded the teacher because he was the ONLY one in the class that could solve the equation. The teacher couldn't even do it. He LOVED doing math, writing computer programs, etc.... He went on to get a job at JPL(Jet Propulsion Labratories), a division of NASA. So what was the thing HE shared with many other I knew like him? Parents that were in an area of interest that CARED! He wasn't treated like just some KID.

Steve

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tagiscom

13 years ago

That's exactly the attitude that would concern me - there's nothing wrong with professional careers and nothing wrong with working a job, either.

If his son is so successful - that might be a reason for school to refuse the offer. They might worry his goal is to encourage other 10 yr olds to start a business - and many parents would not appreciate that or be willing to support it.

Yep, that is it in a nutshell, they don't want their kids mucking around on benefits, trying to get something to work, or worse quit college, etc earlier than expected.

Obviously be best time to make it is when you are young, low overheads, plenty of time, etc. A lot of online successes happened when they were young and where able to basically sleep near their computer, put in the hard work, and get it to take off!

I can understand parents concerns, spend your whole life working for your kids futures, and you want to give them the best odds, of success. Being potentially very successful is riskier, but the rewards, and long term benefits far exceed a 9 to 5 career.

The other reason is, most parents only know how to work hard for someone else, so, they couldn't really help their siblings, if they did go down that path, although some like Thomas Edison, etc made their own minds up!

That's in the public system. In the private system they churn out executives and generals.

Neither system is geared towards producing anything other than cogs in the machine(s).

Despite the fact that back in my day free thinking was encouraged, it was still geared towards fitting you into an existing "machine", rather than the being the creator of a new machine(s).

It has always been that way, and sadly it always will.

Yep, they did a career test for a very successful online marketer, in high school, (before he went online) and said that because he had ATDD, as well as other issue, that a garbage collector was his perfect vocation, he promptly told them an appropriate word or two, and went online...

Frank Kern was his name....

Shane

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mcwalker25

13 years ago

If you guys feel that schools are meant to program kids, what are your alterntives? Would any onefind the time to homeschool their children?

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Audrey Harvey 13 years ago

Originally Posted by mcwalker25

If you guys feel that schools are meant to program kids, what are your alterntives? Would any one find the time to homeschool their children?

I've been homeschooling my two for almost 8 years now so yes, it's a valid alternative.

One workshop is all the businessman offered, he wasn't asking to rewrite the curriculum or make any other massive changes to what schools do. That one workshop may have been enough to plant a seed.

Wish your friend was Down Under, I'm sure our large and enthusiastic homeschool community would make him very welcome.
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Dan Riffle

13 years ago

I have to agree with Kay on this one. At ten, children should concentrate on core competencies, creativity and simply being children. There's only so much time in a school day. As we keep adding subjects like social engineering and vocational subjects, we take away time from basic skill building.

Schools -- and I can't believe I'm actually going to defend the public education system! -- have to educate the masses and do so in a manner that is best suited for the broad base. The vast majority of people will never own their own business. It's just the way it is. Not everyone is cut out to own their own business.

That's not to say that courses can't be offered for students who show interest and/or the skill set to follow the entrepreneurial path. However, it's simply a waste of time to shove it down the throat of every child.

I'd much rather see students be able to read at grade level and have a solid understanding of critical thinking. Once that happens, the chips will fall where they may.

Edited to add: I'm talking about elementary students here. As they get into middle school and high school, I can certainly see positive reasons to include entrepreneurial coursework.

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thunderbird

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Dan Riffle

<snip>

That's not to say that courses can't be offered for students who show interest and/or the skill set to follow the entrepreneurial path. However, it's simply a waste of time to shove it down the throat of every child.<snip>

Presenting kids with some concepts in a single workshop is not "shove it down the throat of every child". Fearing that it would cause kids to take an entrepreneurial path too early in life is like fearing that every kid would become an MMA fighter after seeing a single martial arts presentation.

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Dan Riffle

13 years ago

Originally Posted by thunderbird

Presenting kids with some concepts in a single workshop is not "shove it down the throat of every child". Fearing that it would cause kids to take an entrepreneurial path too early in life is like fearing that every kid would become an MMA fighter after seeing a single martial arts presentation.

TB, the conversation started to drift into a broader sense. You're correct, one workshop isn't "shoving it down the throat of every child." However, I don't think the general ten year old will get the point when they're more concerned about eating their own boogers and desperately finding someone to give them a cootie shot.

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thunderbird

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Dan Riffle

TB, the conversation started to drift into a broader sense. You're correct, one workshop isn't "shoving it down the throat of every child." However, I don't think the general ten year old will get the point when they're more concerned about eating their own boogers and desperately finding someone to give them a cootie shot.

I think high schoolers are harder to teach. Hormones and desire to meet the hormone-addled, pop-culture-pickled criteria of their peers render them borderline-retarded, as evidenced by their wearing pants hanging halfway down their underwear.

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Dan Riffle

13 years ago

Originally Posted by thunderbird

I think high schoolers are harder to teach. Hormones and desire to meet the hormone-addled, pop-culture-pickled criteria of their peers render them borderline-retarded, as evidenced by their wearing pants hanging halfway down their underwear.

"Pop-culture-pickled"

I like that. Can I steal it?

In regard to your point, I dig what you're saying and I like where your heart is. However, the pickled idiots you speak of are ebbing closer and closer to having to support themselves. I would think, but could certainly be wrong, that they would be more receptive to such workshops.

And they probably still eat their own boogers.

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MikeAmbrosio

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Dan Riffle

In regard to your point, I dig what you're saying and I like where your heart is. However, the pickled idiots you speak of are ebbing closer and closer to having to support themselves. I would think, but could certainly be wrong, that they would be more receptive to such workshops.

My 2 adult sons, I could not interest them in my on line/entrepreneurial ways when they were young. In fact, I could not interest either of them in college either. They discovered music and wanted to be rockers

But to this point, both - at 22 and 24 - and NOW taking an interest in doing things on their own. NOW they see the potential.

At 10, forget it. But that's MY kids. Yes, there are exceptions, but mine were more the rule. I think as a parent if you see interest or potential in your kids for ANYTHING beyond what they teach in school, then YOU need to pursue it on their behalf and encourage them (like I did with their music - guitar, bass and drums).

Like workshops, perhaps...

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mojojuju

13 years ago

Was it because your friend is a child molester?

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thunderbird 13 years ago

Originally Posted by mojojuju

Was it because your friend is a child molester?

You must have mistakenly posted a response for another thread. We're talking about a businessman here, not a priest.
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bizgrower

13 years ago

How about offering the workshop outside of school for motivated/parentally supported kids of all ages?

Dan

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bizgrower

13 years ago

If a kid wants to learn - emphasis on kid wants to learn - anything that is not part of a home or public school curriculum, then the parents should find the way. I took guitar lessons from a private instructor and Tae Kwon Do through a community center (instructors from a large dojo). Our local YMCA offered similar courses and we have Colorado Free University which offers all sorts of things and the instructors are paid part of the course fees.

So, I guess I don't see that the school should offer it, but they could communicate the availability of the workshop and maybe provide the space.

Dan

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Mike Murphy

13 years ago

Yep, just plain sad. I 'm sure the teachers/decision makes in that school suffer from the basic mindset block that people don't admit but surely exists..."I don't want someone else to take the road less traveled because I haven't got the guts to and that will remove some of my excuses..."

I've got a 4 year old and an 8 year old and my wife and I are teaching them about entrepreneurship, saving, investing...all the things that for some reason the schools just don't cover.

Oh well, at least they'll be able to calculate pi to the 358th decimal place...cause that's handy.

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School Rejected Offer From Successful Entrepreneur

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