The "realities" of offline = do you sell offline?

by 36 replies
52
I remain amazed at some things here...and I truly wonder how many people actually do work "offline" with (small) business owners?

There seems to be a huge tendency here to underestimate the intelligence of business owners....hello - they are running a business and if they are in business more than a year they have some smarts right?

If you don't "know how" to do something why would you try to sell a business owner on "your" services? I have seen people here get hired to freelance "market" or build a website and they have NO idea what they are doing? Ouch

I also see people try to make a buck by selling things to business owners that don't make sense....way overpriced. Many times the person yapping about it is just trying to sell a "wso" to others here....an example of this is trying to say that biz owners will pay you $495 a month to "claim and maintain their yelp page" >>. what a joke


I see people who are so eager to get others to "sell" for them on commission...when what they offer sucks and really why would anyone bother to "sell" it? Some of these (on paper only) ideas are just not saleable.

Also...if you are in another country and don't speak English well, why would an American with any sales skills want to go out and waste their time, gas, etc selling for you? Heck if I wanted to do that I could hire people off fiverr and elance and make all the money

If you can't "sell" it yourself...maybe it is NOT saleable

Not every idea is a good idea...face it...and business owners are not stupid...repeat that again.

The other thing I find odd around here is that when people are pushing their (on paper, pie in sky) "plan" they fail to take into account that small biz owners are hard to pin down, quirky...often have no idea what their password is, don't have their graphics files, they sit down to do business and "their biz" interrupts (my best example - I was sitting with a pizza shop owner when a fire broke out in his kitchen!)

My advice to people who want to work offline is simple : want to cold call? afraid? then go get a part time job in a phone room and learn the skills

want to sell in person offline? then sign up as an independent rep with a company or two (non conflicting)....offer some "real" things like printing or ad space or whatever....and sell your own stuff too if it is ok (non conflict)....you may at least learn sales skills...get your foot in the door...and learn what it is really like to deal with small biz owners
#offline marketing #offline #realities #sell
  • For me this is a very timely post. For some reason in the past few months I have had a higher number than usual of people pitching me idea where they want me to be their partner because what they think is missing is "you just need to sell it".

    Problem is their ideas do NOT deliver adequate value to the end client. You simply cannot overcome that.

    Now don't get me wrong I am a marketer. I LOVE building funnels, relationships and massaging someone towards sales that require education and time BUT as far as I am concerned no amount of sales pitch is going to overcome the idea just being plain stupid, too expensive or not delivering value.

    As you said with your example of claiming the Yelp page, sure you may be able to hard sell some people on doing that but if you are truly not delivering value and your only claim to fame is being able to talk anybody into buying anything you will not last long. Even if you do last long at it, its not the kind of life I want.

    Much easier and much more gratifying to actually find something people need/want and that delivers positive ROI. When you combine solid marketing with something that almost sells itself life is good.
    • [ 2 ] Thanks
    • [1] reply
    • I get the same thing.

      But it isn't "Just sell it", it's really, "Just provide the service". The selling is 90% of the effort. Almost all the skill is in the selling.

      Have you ever bought a $20 book? How much do you think the author gets?

      About $2. But didn't he do all the work? He wrote the whole thing. Why doesn't he get 90% of the money? Because the selling is the real work. Books have to be promoted and sold. And services need to be sold.


      Someone says to me, "I got this great deal. It's an internet service I sell. I get 20% of the money, and all I have to do is sell the darn thing".

      I'm thinking, "What? If I sold that service for $5,000...I'd just find someone to fulfill for $1,000...and keep the rest."

      Even great IT guys are essentially talents that can be hired. It's technical competency. But selling? That's where the real work is. That's what hard.

      "You just need to sell it" is like saying, "Here is a large rock. There, all you need to do is carve it into a statue. Let's split the profits 50/50."

      Anyway, back to work for me.
      • [ 9 ] Thanks
    • [DELETED]
      • [ 1 ] Thanks
  • I completely agree FreebieQueen. I have become so disenchanted with the run of the mill, wage slave jobs that lead to nowhere at worst and a life of mediocrity at best. I'm 24 and I finally realized that if I want to have a life of significance and of financial freedom, I need to become a master salesman. Selling is everything in life and if you can become great at it, you can truly write your own ticket.
  • No, they're not stupid.

    And they're tight with the dollar.

    I'm working in a retail niche where the average business does over 1/2 a mill per year, and they'll fight you tooth & nail over $399 a month for "done for you" marketing services.

    I read here about folks trying to sell $1,500 a month web site services and I'm wondering what prospects with unlimited budgets are these folks talking to.
    • [5] replies
    • Can't be explained better..
    • Often the niche does determine the amount of cash businesses are willing to spend towards outsourcing various services.

      I work for one client that pays excess of 1500 monthly for my consultancy services but they sell products between $6800 and the average is $22k per sale.

      They have a facebook specialist that they pay similar amounts to.

      They have a web designer they pay similar amounts to just for maintenance.

      They have a feng shui consultant they also pay similarly

      they also spend about the same on domestic flights each month....

      ...notice a pattern?

      Many smaller businesses that will argue with you over $399 monthly are quite happy to pay Google $1000 + much like they were prepared to pay $10 -20K for Yellow pages in the past.

      You need to ask yourself "why would businesses pay Google $1000 Plus but they won't pay me $399?"

      I'd say it could be because Google brings the heat if you know how to maximise Adwords...

      ...and...

      ...the results are measurable.

      PLUS you can test and change things in an instant.

      There are plenty of consultants who manage adwords accounts in the thousands of dollars each month and they are not charging $399.

      The thing is to become good at what you do so that you can confidently charge a higher price and understand how to sell the client on the value you will deliver.

      One great example of a consultant who does know his stuff and I expect has no shortage of clients is Justin Roff-Marsh Ballistix | Sales Process Engineering

      Justin gives away a lot of good free content because he understands that you get paid to Implement. When you become a proficient implementer of the services you offer and you build a reputation for delivering results you can choose what you want to charge and who you want to work with.

      Just take a look at his Managed SPE service.

      I'd almost suggest that the person who is charging $399 for some marketing service is in the no-mans land of positioning.

      You would be better going in and saying you charge $12K to fix such and such and you can do that in 3 - 6 months. then you can say charge a maintenance charge that is in the range you are promoting.

      Business owners are scared of recurring billing but if you have a proven product (google) the recurring fees are easily justified.

      Anyone with experience in business knows that most things that make a big difference cost a significant investment.

      Want to dabble in radio spend $5k for starters easily.

      Want to have a quality website designed that converts traffic with secure shopping, data management system etc etc expect $10K plus if you are doing something serious.

      We have a designer and coder on team and although we can knock out template websites quickly it really does take work ,,,constant work....to design, custom code parts and set up shopping sites of any significance.

      Even when we are redesigning our own sites we incur some serious wage costs.

      There are a multitude of budget solutions out there but are they making any money?

      If they are, it is because they have serious cost advantages over you.

      Sure there are plenty of people trying to read what a small business owner will pay for marketing but most of these people come across at rank amateurs so business owners quibble about the price....

      ...it's just they don't trust you or they think what you are offering is BS.

      If you position yourself to compete with the multitude of cold calling people who tout their SEO, offer Page 1 ranking, etc , etc....

      ...you position yourself for a world of pain.

      Sure cut your teeth on Nickels and Dimes but once you got something that works step up and charge business prices for business services.
      • [ 6 ] Thanks
      • [1] reply


    • Michael,

      I agree that business owners are not stupid.

      I think you need a breakthrough client who is on the same page as you with respect to
      business growth.

      I think that when you are talking to prospects and establishing the value and ROI of your services,
      you need to qualify them based on their belief, savvy, ambition, and desire for more business.

      Do they think they can go from $500,000 a year to $550,000, or whatever their next milestone is?

      Do they want to?

      Are they thinking it will take one or two more staff members and not sure they want that additional responsibility, time, and payroll?

      Will it mean more hours for them?

      Are they ambitious and wanting to open two more stores?

      Do they have key staff members resisting growth because it means more work without much more reward? (I run the show at my hotel. I could add another $100,000 to revenues the next 12 months. I'm reluctant because I want a lot more salary or bonus, don't think I can get the owner to add another staff member, don't want to work much harder than I am, and don't want to increase the value too much because I want to buy the hotel.)

      On the other hand, do they want to stay at about $500,000 a year and just want some current web presence because it's just an expected thing?

      Do they enjoy their current life?

      Are they looking forward to retirement?

      Do they see that more revenue would help them hire a key person so they can spend their time
      on the things they really want to spend their time on?

      I've had prospects who went under instead of to their next milestone because they did not
      have the realization, ambition, vision, or savvy to go for the next level.

      Anyway, maybe try to get at these personal things when you talk to prospects.

      Dan
      • [1] reply
    • Well MOST businesses that are worth targeting are doing much more than 500k/year. That really isn't very much.

      Those businesses also aren't in retail.
      • [1] reply
    • It isn't how much business they are doing. It's how much they are used to paying for similar services.
      If the company does no advertising at all, you have to sell the entire concept of advertising, then you have to sell the entire concept of online advertising. Then you have to sell the entire concept of giving you money to do it for them.

      But, if they are already paying 5 other people, an average of $800 a month, each, to promote their business....a sale should be far easier....because they are used to paying this money.

      I don't even ask how much business they do in a year.
      • [ 2 ] Thanks
      • [1] reply
  • I sell offline and have been doing so since June 2012 and over the years what I've learnt is that you can sell all day long but if can't close, then you're just a professional conversationalist. I only really GOT it until last December 2014. Ever since then, my closing ratio has gone through the roof! and it's because I know how to close properly and apply the right pressure.

    I've pitched and spoken to many business owners and I'm telling you, they are NOT stupid. If you're selling ethically then the customer will question what value you bring to the table and this is where you show your A game.

    The customer wants an ROI with X spend and if you can't show it in anyway, no deal is going to be made. Managing a facebook/yelp, whatever account for $495pm might get you the deal for a month or 2 (if the owner is open minded / stupid) but sooner or later, if you can't translate that to leads, customers, enquires then you WILL lose this account. And before you say, "We got this amount of yelp visits or facebook likes" So what, show me the customers / increased enquiries.

    You have to understand the customers needs and devise a solution, but you still have to sell that solution. Before you even pitch, if you qualify right at the start, the customer will tell you everything that is required for a sale.

    Don't even start selling until they tick all the right boxes. I'll give you a good example. I had a lead from twitter come in and I started qualifying, asking deep questions.

    I found out from qualifying that she was also contacting other companies, and that her boss wanted a cheap solution (was too cheap for me), and that she was also seeing another company locally that she already is working with. All red flags to me, so I didn't even pursue the sale because the chance of landing that account was slim. On the other hand, there was another twitter lead. I also asked if he contacted anyone else and no one did. Come presentation time, his objection was "Got to speak to my wife". With a bit of sales pressure, he finally said yes...Because I believed it was the right thing to do.

    So as you can see, before you even sell, do they qualify and is the need there? Both cases above, I've saved time and money by putting my energy in the right places.

    Here's another tip. Just because you have a lead or enquiry, however large the potential account is, unless they fit your hoops, you don't move a muscle. Its not illegal to reject a lead btw.

    When I was at my day job, a few years ago, I was paid $23,000 annually and couldn't see a way out or a pay increase, so I quit and decided to write my own checks but I've only become a true salesman since Dec 14.

    Selling is everything in life, if you can't sell, you will be sold to all your life whether that is for money or an idea.
    • [ 3 ] Thanks
    • [1] reply
    • Michael,

      Your point on selling is everything in life is being proven everyday this dumbass presidential sweepstakes is happening in the US. Unfortunately there are people who don't take any lessons from these wannabe peoples boss. That really is all the president looks at him(her)self as. No you are saying. Well sire, look at the big O's executive orders. They don't apply to average Joe citizen but everybody acts like they do. Why? Because they've been sold a BS package second to none. My point is if you want to sell, look at how the professionals are doing it. No better place to learn than from your masters.

  • so damm true.. I never understand people claim they can sell 3 crappy websites in 6 hours of cold calling at 2000$ each.. why on earth they spending all their time online to sell their crappy pdf for 9$ a pop.

    Dude come on don't be so damn bit**. If you already made trillions of dollars then don't beg for 9$ all day to everyone instead go out and enjoy life.
    • [1] reply

    • LOL....so true

      I also wonder "whatever happened to"....

      we have people fly in and out of here....often with crazy ideas....how did it go? what happened? gung ho...then on to the next idea

      some of them "hit and run"...never hear what happened
      • [ 1 ] Thanks
  • [DELETED]
  • The fact is if the business own is wealthy, not worried about money, etc...then spending big on a good service is a good deal to them and no problem.

    No matter how good the deal is, if they are broke or next to, they simply can't afford it.

    Paintings go for $20million+. If you can afford it great. But would an art dealer try and sell this to your "average Joe?"
    • [1] reply
    • This isn't the way it always works. The rich people are often more frugal with their money while the people without much money spend it easier.

      Also, business owners who are doing well can continue to do well without needing more customers to survive, while a business owner who is doing poorly desperately needs more customers and is more likely to spend their money (or borrowed money) to get those customers in order to survive.
      • [2] replies
Join the discussion

Next Topics on Trending Feed

  • 52

    The "realities" of offline = do you sell offline?

    I remain amazed at some things here...and I truly wonder how many people actually do work "offline" with (small) business owners? There seems to be a huge tendency here to underestimate the intelligence of business owners....hello - they are running a business and if they are in business more than a year they have some smarts right?