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The 3 nos rule

by socialentry
14 replies
Hi there,

In successful telephone selling in the 90s, the author writes that studies show that it is better to rebutt until the prospect says no/not interested 3 times.

According to him. after that, it means diminishing returns. Less then this and the caller is not persistent enough.

Unfortunately, there's no bibliography so I can't look up the study, but I have heard of local call centers using this. What do you think of the 3 nos rule?
#nos #rule
  • Profile picture of the author Eddie Spangler
    Heard this story long time ago off of either a Brian Tracy or Zig Ziglar tape, not sure if it was about either of them or if it was relaying a story of another salesman but it goes like this:


    When Im trying to close someone I want to really make sure that he doesnt want it before I give up and will keep trying over and over... so by the time the guy has told me no 7 times Im saying to myself "I dont think this guy is really interested, so Im ONLY going to try 1 more time."
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  • Profile picture of the author Jason Kanigan
    All prospects lie. They don't know you when you first call, so they have no reason to trust you, and they're skeptical. So the first thing out of their mouths, unless they are in serious pain and have already acknowledged to themselves that they need help with whatever it is you're offering, is going to be, "We're good" or "No thank you" or "Not interested."

    So the first No is almost always total BS.

    We can't qualify Out people just because they have told us No that first or second time. Those are almost certainly knee-jerk protective reactions from the prospect, who is trying to stop themselves from getting ripped off.

    It's actually hard to get a legit "No" and really qualify someone Out.

    Next time you dial, make it a goal to get 10 real, truly qualified "No"s before you stop. It'll take you longer than you think! And you'll learn a lot, too.
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  • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
    In my office ...

    If you don't rebut AND close a minimum of three times, you don't have a job.

    -

    Now to be honest, it isn't because 3 times or more is a magic number.
    It is to ensure people don't waste leads and aren't searching for the lay downs.

    Almost every sales job I had ... had that same rule. I did not make it up,
    I just transferred it when i opened my second office and have kept it instituted.

    BTW, my first phone room, I thought I was smarter then everyone i ever worked for
    I said... I am going to be different, I am not going to make everyone follow all those
    stupid rules I hated when i worked for other people ... People will flock to my
    office because they will love working here ... it will be fun.

    My first office failed.

    Also, something you should know.

    The longer you do sales, the less you need rebuttals.
    There will come a time when you know what rebuttals are, but
    you cant remember the last time you actually used one.
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    • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
      Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

      In my office ...

      If you don't rebut AND close a minimum of three times, you don't have a job.

      -

      Now to be honest, it isn't because 3 times or more is a magic number.
      It is to ensure people don't waste leads and aren't searching for the lay downs.

      Almost every sales job I had ... had that same rule. I did not make it up,
      I just transferred it when i opened my second office and have kept it instituted.

      BTW, my first phone room, I thought I was smarter then everyone i ever worked for
      I said... I am going to be different, I am not going to make everyone follow all those
      stupid rules I hated when i worked for other people ... People will flock to my
      office because they will love working here ... it will be fun.

      My first office failed.

      Also, something you should know.

      The longer you do sales, the less you need rebuttals.
      There will come a time when you know what rebuttals are, but
      you cant remember the last time you actually used one.
      The "3 Nos Rule" sounds a lot like the "7 closes to get a sale rule".

      It's something that someone quoted in an unrelated report, and it was said often enough that people started believing it...and then Zig said it, so it must be true.

      Three is not a magic number, and for an advanced salesperson to adhere to that would be stupid. But when hiring reps? They need structure, because they have no idea what the difference is between a judgement call and a mistake.

      Me? I close until one of two things happen;
      1) Each negative response becomes stronger. In other words, their "No" is getting stronger. This could take two or ten attempts.
      2) Their "No"s become weaker, and you can see that there is a change coming where they will accept your idea and buy.

      But the prospect lets me know when either of those things are happening. Not a rule.

      And again, Ken is right. After you reach a certain level in selling..."No"s simply go away. (although, cold calling, the initial "No", right off the bat will still come). But Kanigan has a cure for that.

      By the way, when I say "No"s go away, I mean people stop saying "No". I don't mean they all buy.

      When I'm selling my online marketing service one on one, I almost always hear one of two things (It's like they all went to a seminar or something)

      "Wow, I can't wait to get started on this. Let's do it" or
      "Wow, I can't wait to get started on this...just as soon as we...." (Which so far, has always meant "No". Enough times that I no longer follow up)
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      • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
        Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

        "Wow, I can't wait to get started on this...just as soon as we...."
        Yeah... the moment i hear that, i just want to reach through the phone and stab them in the eye.

        I cant help it. When i was taught.. everything is your fault .. everything.

        every no .. means you messed up

        bookoo years later ... i know that isn't true... but i still believe it.
        I still treat ever prospect the same way ...

        In my heart I know if they did not buy, it is because I messed up.
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        • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
          Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

          Yeah... the moment i hear that, i just want to reach through the phone and stab them in the eye.

          I cant help it. When i was taught.. everything is your fault .. everything.

          every no .. means you messed up

          bookoo years later ... i know that isn't true... but i still believe it.
          I still treat ever prospect the same way ...

          In my heart I know if they did not buy, it is because I messed up.
          I imagine this; After every sale I miss...
          If I could go back in time repeatedly, until just before I talked to them, and kept doing it differently...or found out more about them...eventually everyone would buy from me. This is the closest thing I have to what you would call a "Belief".

          I honestly see it as my fault that they didn't buy. Intellectually, I know it's not true. But viscerally.....It really is true.

          And I think I know why they didn't buy. You and I can appeal to them intellectually and emotionally... but when I hear "We are definitely going to buy from you as soon as..."...I think I know what happened.

          They have deep seated wants that originate in their lizard brain...that I haven't locked onto. They don't even know why they are saying "No". And there is no way, except living with them for years, to really know what those deep triggers are.

          As most people can't tell you accurately why they said "Yes".

          Anyway, that's my theory. I call it um... "Claude's Theory". Catchy, eh?
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          • Profile picture of the author RimaNaj2011
            What do you guys say after the first no? I'm pretty straight up so I'll say "well why not?" but you shouldn't be asking yes/no questions to begin with. If you do a good job finding the problem and then offering your solution, you shouldn't get a no. If I do, I accept it as genuine. No need to be pushy. Maybe follow up a week later.
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            • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
              Originally Posted by RimaNaj2011 View Post

              What do you guys say after the first no? I'm pretty straight up so I'll say "well why not?" but you shouldn't be asking yes/no questions to begin with. If you do a good job finding the problem and then offering your solution, you shouldn't get a no. If I do, I accept it as genuine. No need to be pushy. Maybe follow up a week later.
              When you say "after the first No", do you mean at the beginning of the conversation or when you are closing at the end. It makes a big difference.
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              • Profile picture of the author bawls
                There is a sale made on every pitch, either you sale them on your ideas or they sale you on why they can't. You just need to be better at sales than they are.

                a "NO" is a three point shot
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            • Profile picture of the author misterme
              Originally Posted by RimaNaj2011 View Post

              What do you guys say after the first no? I'm pretty straight up so I'll say "well why not?" but you shouldn't be asking yes/no questions to begin with. If you do a good job finding the problem and then offering your solution, you shouldn't get a no. If I do, I accept it as genuine. No need to be pushy. Maybe follow up a week later.
              You get these first objections and maybe they're about price. Or whatever. So you empathize with a "I understand..." and now you do a segue to continue the conversation. But not a continuing conversation about the objection, though to segue I may use the "feel, felt, found" technique to do that. Or a question. But I introduce a somewhat new topic instead. Because many times, something else that's said, uncovers something, and lights a bulb in the prospect's head and turns everything around.

              I wouldn't ask them their reasons why not because I don't want them branding into their minds their reasons not to buy in by having them repeat it out loud.
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  • Profile picture of the author Rearden
    The assumption here is that you have a properly, pre-qualified prospect.

    Great salespeople will know all of the top objections to buying and develop a method to deal with them early in the sales call.
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  • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
    Originally Posted by Ken_Caudill View Post

    Searching for laydowns is my life's work.
    Me too. It's how I met my first wife.
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  • Profile picture of the author kellyyarnsbro
    There could be other reason why prospect says no, could be that they don't find the product interesting or helpful which is the most difficult to close deal with. It could also happen that when they say no because money is tight that time when you call them.
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